New Ofcom Market bands announced

[ReedRichards]

At a presentation to South Cambridgeshire District council (and associates) on 2nd December 2011.

[prichardson]

There are a number of Market 1 exchanges with FTTC.
For a moment, it's best to ignore Northern Ireland and Cornwall, mainly because of the way in which the projects were deployed. Deddington is set for FTTP which is Market 1, though this too is a specially picked exchange to trial.
One exchange I am aware of from the top of my head is Capel.

[WWWombat]

Isn't that another special case? I recall Capel was one of the "Race to Infinity" winners.

[paxy]

@Jameseh I was told on twitter by plusnet months back there there was one due??! The exchange has now been a market 2 for 18 months, but is still classified as a market 1.

[ReedRichards]

I think the best we can hope for is that this review http://stakeholders.ofcom.org.uk/consultations/review-wholesale-broadband/summary completes on schedule some time in 2014.

[davidj66]

@ReedRichards...but the problem for us poor s*ds left on "Market 1" and ADSL Max connections is that in two years time we won't be able to use much of the content available because we just won't have the bandwidth - there wil be lucky so and sos on 330Mb unlimited connections!! Really have difficulty in understanding why the review can't be completed at least a year quicker!!!

[WWWombat]

If you really are stuck on "market 1" and only "ADSL Max", then how is an Ofcom market review going to help you? It isn't going to get you faster speeds, and probably won't get you cheaper connections (there's already a process in place that causes an annual reduction in the wholesale price).
Surely a review only helps those in an exchange that has unbundled operators now, but that Ofcom hadn't recognised in the last review so classified them (wrongly, as it turns out) as "market 1".
I think you need *something*, but Ofcom's review isn't it.

[WWWombat]

By the way, in reference to this part:

Quote from: ReedRichards

I don't know if this is true but I went to a presentation by BT where they said they have no plans to make FTTC available at Market 1 exchanges.  Whether this makes good business sense is debatable.  Although getting the government to subsidise your business, as BT have, must be good.

The effect of BDUK funding for North Yorkshire appears to be that it has included 120 extra exchanges into the programme, of which 110 are "market 1". 21 of those are getting FTTP (all between 200 and 600 properties).
The NY BDUK programme have said that their programme involves some 700 cabinets.

[ReedRichards]

I'm on a Market 1 exchange that was upgraded to 21CN/ADSL2+ earlier this year.  Since the last Ofcom review in Dec 2010 my exchange has gained two LLU providers, Sky and TalkTalk so if Ofcom were to look again the exchange would be reclassified as Market 2.
When Ofcom launched its Market classifications, the expectation was that these would be reviewed annually.  The whole purpose of the price structure was to encourage LLU providers into telephone exchanges where they did not have a presence.  It is wholly wrong of Ofcom not to acknowledge this when it happens and it will cost me hundreds of pounds if I stick with Plusnet.       

[davidj66]

Quote from: WWWombat

If you really are stuck on "market 1" and only "ADSL Max", then how is an Ofcom market review going to help you? It isn't going to get you faster speeds, and probably won't get you cheaper connections (there's already a process in place that causes an annual reduction in the wholesale price). Surely a review only helps those in an exchange that has unbundled operators now, but that Ofcom hadn't recognised in the last review so classified them (wrongly, as it turns out) as "market 1".

Won't get faster speeds agreed (assuming BTO regard us as "uncommercial"); but would save more than a few bob for a bigger d/load allowance since our exchange SHOULD be classified as Market 2 now.!!

[ReedRichards]

I don't think the UK allows a "Class Action lawsuit" or we could get together and sue Ofcom for the financial losses incurred from their failure to review market classifications in a timely manner.

[WWWombat]

The last Ofcom review was done with knowledge of what the various CP plans were - so Ofcom were privvy to Sky & TalkTalk's intentions at the time. The market definitions took these intentions into account - and defined market 2 & 3 to be any place where those operators intended to go, but hadn't yet.
So now you get the perverse situation that there could be market 1, 2 and 3 locations that could be wrong.
I agree that Ofcom *ought* to have recognised the failing, and performed an interim re-classification for some locations.
However, I can also see that, from the operators perspective, they make investment decisions based on the market definitions... and need *some* period of stability to be capable of getting a return.
The trick in the new consultations will be getting both aspects right.

[paxy]

Last figures I could find suggested that 11.7% of customers were on Market 1 - Plusnet has taken a business decision to charge these customers significantly more to keep their headline price for the majority down.  So the £17.99 v £9.99 for unlimited would probably be something like £10.92 if it was a level playing field for all (using simple maths which I know it isn't!)

[spraxyt]

In that case Market 2 and 3 customers would be paying more to subsidise the higher Ofcom regulated wholesale costs of providing service in Market 1 exchanges. Ofcom seem to think this approach will encourage competitors to put their equipment into such BT exchanges. Why isn't there a rush?

[Luzern]

Now what sort of users inhabit Market 1 exchange areas? Are they more likely or not to use high bandwidth allowances than those in Market 2/3?
If M1 users tend toward the low end, then may be a higher charge has the same reasoning as the two tier power tariffs; the need to recover investment costs over a reasonable time. Isn't the other providers' lack of interest an indication that recovery would be slow?