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Fairness at work.

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Fairness at work.

Are UK firefighters undervalued and underpaid?
17 REPLIES
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RE: Fairness at work.

> Are UK firefighters undervalued and underpaid?

Yeah just the same as everyone else in every other profession
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RE: Fairness at work.

> Are UK firefighters undervalued and underpaid?

Yeah just the same as everyone else in every other profession
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RE: Fairness at work.

Lets talk nurses if you want to open a debate, my wife works in Nottingham QMC and deals with womens health, she holds dead babies in her hands every day and has to deal with the psychological effects this has on mothers, she earns £15k per annum. Is this fair?

elton
Grafter
Posts: 175
Registered: 30-07-2007

RE: Fairness at work.

> Lets talk nurses if you want to open a debate, my wife works in Nottingham QMC and deals with womens health, she holds dead babies in her hands every day and has to deal with the psychological effects this has on mothers, she earns £15k per annum. Is this fair?
>
>

Of course it's fair! Nursing has always been badly paid and everyone knows this when they apply. People become nurses because they want to. Nobody makes them do it. As for firefighters - they have an excellent career structure, with rank and salary according to ambition and ability. If you don't like the pay, why not get a better job intead of complaining about it?

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Skonko!
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RE: Fairness at work.

Actually I wasnt complaining, and if you had gone to school you would realise that! I was merely making a point, and my wife does have an excellent career path, and yes she was aware that the wages were poor. The point i was making was that relatively speaking she recieves very poor pay for the amount of duress/stress she recieves.
elton
Grafter
Posts: 175
Registered: 30-07-2007

RE: Fairness at work.

> Actually I wasnt complaining, and if you had gone to school you would realise that! I was merely making a point, and my wife does have an excellent career path, and yes she was aware that the wages were poor. The point i was making was that relatively speaking she recieves very poor pay for the amount of duress/stress she recieves.

It read like a complaint to me. And it read like a request for sympathy for those on a low income. I'm sorry, but I firmly believe that nobody in this country is poor, or badly paid. You just have to look around and see all the fat "poor" people to see that. And nobody is forced to do a job they don't want to do. We live in a wonderful country. We are truly free. And rich to boot!
I did actually go to school. I didn't like it at all, and left with few qualifications. But one thing I did learn was this little ditty: "'I' before 'E', except after 'C'". As in "receives".
I worked in a fridge factory as a machine operator when I left school, putting a piece of steel in a press, pressing a button, then taking it out again. I did it 900 times per hour, 8 hours a day, on shifts. Ten years ago I went to Durham University and got a BSc.(hons.) in Computer Science. Now I'm a senior analyst/programmer with a large investment bank. I live in a very big house, and I have more money than I can possibly spend. My old dad joined the fire service as a (civilian) clerk. He retired as Chief Fire Officer, with an O.B.E., on a very comfortable pension.
There's really no point in complaining.

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Skonko!
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RE: Fairness at work.

I thought you might have a few bob.
I always find that when we start to do well, we quickly forget how others have it hard, but then, thats just inherent in human beings, myself not excluded.
I too went back to school and did engineering and have a reasonably paid job but it doesnt stop me thinking about how other professions who actually are a practical benefit to society on the scale of things, are so badly paid.
Lets have a look at how we managed to achieve these degrees at the end of the day. on our own, not realy and when we do finally start to get ill in our old age or our partner have our kids, who'll be there, wont it be the nurses?
Its soooo easy to be on top of the pile.
deakie
elton
Grafter
Posts: 175
Registered: 30-07-2007

RE: Fairness at work.

> I thought you might have a few bob.
> I always find that when we start to do well, we quickly forget how others have it hard, but then, thats just inherent in human beings, myself not excluded.
> I too went back to school and did engineering and have a reasonably paid job but it doesnt stop me thinking about how other professions who actually are a practical benefit to society on the scale of things, are so badly paid.
> Lets have a look at how we managed to achieve these degrees at the end of the day. on our own, not realy and when we do finally start to get ill in our old age or our partner have our kids, who'll be there, wont it be the nurses?
> Its soooo easy to be on top of the pile.
> deakie
>

I agree with some of what you're saying. But it wasn't easy getting to "the top of the pile" (not that I believe I am). And it certainly isn't easy staying there. Especially as a 45 year old in the software industry, especially in investnment banking, given the current climate. It was a whole lot easier working in the fridge factory, despite the mind numbing tedium, and pathetic pay.
But when I'm old and sick, I'll rest easy on my death bed knowing that the wonderful NHS nurses who'll take care of me will be there because of the level of tax and ni payments I'm making now. I pay my way, and a lot of other peoples way too I expect.
When's the next council workers strike? Why do bin men deserve more pay? Can they not afford Sky Sports? That's a real shame. The fact is, anybody could do that job, and there's no labour shortage. That's why they're paid what they are paid.


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Skonko!
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RE: Fairness at work.

> > I thought you might have a few bob.
> > I always find that when we start to do well, we quickly forget how others have it hard, but then, thats just inherent in human beings, myself not excluded.
> > I too went back to school and did engineering and have a reasonably paid job but it doesnt stop me thinking about how other professions who actually are a practical benefit to society on the scale of things, are so badly paid.
> > Lets have a look at how we managed to achieve these degrees at the end of the day. on our own, not realy and when we do finally start to get ill in our old age or our partner have our kids, who'll be there, wont it be the nurses?
> > Its soooo easy to be on top of the pile.
> > deakie
> >
>
> I agree with some of what you're saying. But it wasn't easy getting to "the top of the pile" (not that I believe I am). And it certainly isn't easy staying there. Especially as a 45 year old in the software industry, especially in investnment banking, given the current climate. It was a whole lot easier working in the fridge factory, despite the mind numbing tedium, and pathetic pay.
> But when I'm old and sick, I'll rest easy on my death bed knowing that the wonderful NHS nurses who'll take care of me will be there because of the level of tax and ni payments I'm making now. I pay my way, and a lot of other peoples way too I expect.
> When's the next council workers strike? Why do bin men deserve more pay? Can they not afford Sky Sports? That's a real shame. The fact is, anybody could do that job, and there's no labour shortage. That's why they're paid what they are paid.
>
>
>
> --
> Skonko!

14th August is the next council strike. And as a frustrated IT graduate working in Local Government, supporting financial databases, leading large projects and supporting networks, of course we should strike. When you realise admin officers are on the same salary as yourself it makes a joke of the whole thing. And binmen are on a greater salary than me - it's pathetic. I support Oracle databases, lead very large government projects, support multiple networks, how do you think I feel when a binman with nothing up top who finishes work in the mid afternoon takes home a bigger salary than me - OF COURSE IT'S TIME TO STRIKE. Not that it will do much good because thjis strike is for a percentage increase for all staff and therefore the salary difference will increase if anything. So while you have a go at binmen (wishing I was one) spare a thought for IT staff.
elton
Grafter
Posts: 175
Registered: 30-07-2007

RE: Fairness at work.

>
> 14th August is the next council strike. And as a frustrated IT graduate working in Local Government, supporting financial databases, leading large projects and supporting networks, of course we should strike. When you realise admin officers are on the same salary as yourself it makes a joke of the whole thing. And binmen are on a greater salary than me - it's pathetic. I support Oracle databases, lead very large government projects, support multiple networks, how do you think I feel when a binman with nothing up top who finishes work in the mid afternoon takes home a bigger salary than me - OF COURSE IT'S TIME TO STRIKE. Not that it will do much good because thjis strike is for a percentage increase for all staff and therefore the salary difference will increase if anything. So while you have a go at binmen (wishing I was one) spare a thought for IT staff.

I wasn't having a go at bin men. I was just pointing out that they shouldn't expect an increase in wages (over inflation). Why do you want to go on strike? Why don't you apply for a job in the private sector where your experience, skills, and qualifications will be reflected in your salary? What's the point in complaining. Where's a 6% increase in a rubbish salary going to get you anyway? Do you think you're worth more than a bin man? Not to the local authority you're not.

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Skonko!
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RE: Fairness at work.

Its interesting isnt it?
Which jobs are the most worthy.....
What about politicians, footballers and pop stars.

Even further, in the midst of a deep recession, with respect to the banking system, who are some of the first people to be regarded as dispensible?

In terms of real need, who are the people that society really needs and what are they worht to us? (apart from ho'es hehe).

deakie

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RE: Fairness at work.

At the end of the day nothing in life is fair. I have to agree that the vast majority of people can pick & choose their jobs so if their on poor salary, then they should walk and find something better.

However I disagree about nurses. They put up with so much during their day, the remuneration should be increased. BUT if we look at the NHS overall, what do we actually get. We pay what 11% NI which at one time paid for everything. Now the government gets more money that ever yet we get less services back in return. If there was an opt-out clause for NI, where you paid no NI and had to take out insurances then i'd do that.
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RE: Fairness at work.

i too liked the idea of private insurance until i had to do a stint in the usa.
it is all okay until you get older and start developing symptoms of an illness.
example, i saw an old lady over there who had kidney probs and the insurance companies refused to insure her for that. they would anything else unrelated. wound up selling her home for treatment.
that put me off for life.
you just need to look at car or flood insurance here to get an idea of how they would treat us.
take note, if you have an aids test, you might not get insurance here......hows that for an indicator eh.
deakie
tssk
Grafter
Posts: 117
Registered: 31-07-2007

RE: Fairness at work.

And not one of you has mentioned the obscene amount that MPs get these days, even to the extent of awarding themselves their own pay rises when they choose...
Its indicative of how subservient we are these days, when a man or woman, with no knowledge of any specific subject, who can get a job at the top of the heap at over £100k per annum, and without passing exams or taking any other curricula for advancement... also gets away with around four months paid leave a year. Some of the buggars only turn up at their place of work four or five times a year! And these self same people run YOUR lives...
And we ELECT them to do this at extravagant costly rates?
Any manual worker is worth his weight in gold in comparison...