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Upstream noise margin, dog slow uploads and erratic downloads

100mileshigh
Dabbler
Posts: 15
Registered: 02-02-2014

Upstream noise margin, dog slow uploads and erratic downloads

My migration to Plusnet completed yesterday and the upstream noise margin has shot to 22dB from a previously consistent 9 - 10dB on my last ISP using the same hardware.
As the only thing that has changed between my last ISP and Plusnet is the login details stored on the router and the ISP it connects to, I was wondering why this has happened, and if it would explain why my uploads (even at off-peak hours) were frequently struggling to get beyond being measured in bytes per second, only sometimes getting into Kbps.
Also, whilst I appreciate that the line is retraining, the download speeds are worryingly inconsistent - frequently varying up and down from low double digit Kbps to 610Kbps+ over the duration of a file transfer (happens regardless of size of file being downloaded, and at peak and off-peak times) where as on my last ISP I was getting pretty consistent speeds nearly always approaching the upper end of what my connection will allow (even during the line training from original activation date)
I realise that may be worrying prematurely (I apologise for wasting anyone's time if I am)  and that  things may settle down, but the degradation in quality of service between my last ISP and Plusnet has got me twitching that I may have dropped a clanger here.
Current router and line stats:

Bt Wholesale Speedtest:

Current line speed:
7.15 Mb

The profile on the line has dropped from 6 - 5Mbps during the switchover, but I expect it to recover as download sync speed remains similar between Plusnet and my previous ISP
Just for reference, the router stats from my last ISP pre migration completing (I realise that the standard upload speed on Plusnet is only 448kbs so am not expecting it to match my previous isp's 832kbs unless I pay the difference)

Thanks for any help or input to help calm my worried mind  Smiley
28 REPLIES
thesawdust
Grafter
Posts: 384
Registered: 28-10-2013

Re: Upstream noise margin, dog slow uploads and erratic downloads

Looks like upload is capped, causing the high SNR for the upload.
Chris can you put a request to uncap upload to improve this?  Smiley
Plusnet Staff
Plusnet Staff
Posts: 6,346
Thanks: 31
Fixes: 5
Registered: 26-11-2011

Re: Upstream noise margin, dog slow uploads and erratic downloads

Hi hundredmileshigh,
I've had a look over your account and can see that you've very recently connected with us. Your line will go through an initial 10 day training period where your line will determine what the best speeds are that your line can cope with, with stability in mind of course.
I can uncap the upload speeds, however as you're on 20CN (Up to 6Mb) you would need to pay for the Max Premium product ( http://www.plus.net/support/broadband/products/prioritised-service-faq.shtml ). When your exchange becomes 21CN enabled (Up to 16Mb) we can uncap your upload free of charge.
Please let us know if you're having any issues after the initial 10 day period. If you'd like Max Premium adding, please give us a shout Smiley
Chris Pettitt
Cloud Environments Engineer
Community Veteran
Posts: 26,718
Thanks: 931
Fixes: 10
Registered: 10-04-2007

Re: Upstream noise margin, dog slow uploads and erratic downloads

@thesawdust
Uncapping applies to 21CN exchanges only. He's on 20CN so the only option is Max Premium which costs an extra £7.83 per month.
See http://community.plus.net/forum/index.php/topic,122141.msg1070001.html#msg1070001
Edit: Posting crossed with Chris
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
Broadband: Andrews & Arnold Home::1 (FTTC 80/20)
Line rental: Pulse 8 Home Line Rental (£13/month)
Mobile: iD mobile (£4/month)
thesawdust
Grafter
Posts: 384
Registered: 28-10-2013

Re: Upstream noise margin, dog slow uploads and erratic downloads

@Jelv
I've just noticed he's only on 20CN - my mistake  Smiley
100mileshigh
Dabbler
Posts: 15
Registered: 02-02-2014

Re: Upstream noise margin, dog slow uploads and erratic downloads

Thanks for the rapid replies guys.
If I get the Max Premium added, is it limited in the amount of times I could add/remove it from my service (subject to notice 30 day period for removal)?
My thinking being that I may add it while I am in the 12 month discount period, but remove it should it not prove to be absolutely necessary once the discount period ends.
Plusnet Staff
Plusnet Staff
Posts: 6,346
Thanks: 31
Fixes: 5
Registered: 26-11-2011

Re: Upstream noise margin, dog slow uploads and erratic downloads

That's right, if you had it on for 30 days and wanted to remove it - that's fine.
You can make this change as often as you'd like, bearing in mind the 30 day notice each time you add it back onto your account again.
Chris Pettitt
Cloud Environments Engineer
Superuser
Superuser
Posts: 12,608
Thanks: 3,882
Fixes: 25
Registered: 22-08-2007

Re: Upstream noise margin, dog slow uploads and erratic downloads

@Hundredmileshigh,
Welcome to PN and the forums - sorry to read of your disappointment, however the US SNRM looks about normal!
Who was your previous ISP please?
@Chris / Jelv,
I note with a little concern the OP's reference to US SNRM with their old ISP.  Is this possibly a consequence of moving from a LLU supplied service to BT supplied service, even though the 'last mile' is identical - or am I confused?  I've seen numerous expectation gaps with migrating users against their old provider, however comparing LLU provisioned service and CN20 / CN21 is like comparing apples and pears - though they are each fruit, they are not the same.
Cheers,
Kevin.
Plusnet Staff
Plusnet Staff
Posts: 6,346
Thanks: 31
Fixes: 5
Registered: 26-11-2011

Re: Upstream noise margin, dog slow uploads and erratic downloads

Hi Kevin,
The D-side would be the same, the only difference on LLU is at the exchange. The upload speeds could vary as you say but with a capped upload, there's very little to go off as the speeds are likely to remain the same. I would only really look at the US SNRM if the upload speeds were uncapped and there were problems with the US speed.
Chris Pettitt
Cloud Environments Engineer
100mileshigh
Dabbler
Posts: 15
Registered: 02-02-2014

Re: Upstream noise margin, dog slow uploads and erratic downloads

Quote from: Townman
@Hundredmileshigh,
Welcome to PN and the forums - sorry to read of your disappointment, however the US SNRM looks about normal!
Who was your previous ISP please?
@Chris / Jelv,
I note with a little concern the OP's reference to US SNRM with their old ISP.  Is this possibly a consequence of moving from a LLU supplied service to BT supplied service, even though the 'last mile' is identical - or am I confused?  I've seen numerous expectation gaps with migrating users against their old provider, however comparing LLU provisioned service and CN20 / CN21 is like comparing apples and pears - though they are each fruit, they are not the same.
Cheers,
Kevin.

My exchange is 20CN and has no LLU.
My last ISP was xilo.net
Community Veteran
Posts: 26,718
Thanks: 931
Fixes: 10
Registered: 10-04-2007

Re: Upstream noise margin, dog slow uploads and erratic downloads

There should be no difference in the speeds you see when things settle down as your router will be connected to exactly the same exchange equipment as you were on with Xilo. I don't know whether you'd picked this up but Max Premium, as well as giving faster upload, also gives higher priority on the BT network between you and the Plusnet gateway.
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
Broadband: Andrews & Arnold Home::1 (FTTC 80/20)
Line rental: Pulse 8 Home Line Rental (£13/month)
Mobile: iD mobile (£4/month)
Superuser
Superuser
Posts: 12,608
Thanks: 3,882
Fixes: 25
Registered: 22-08-2007

Re: Upstream noise margin, dog slow uploads and erratic downloads

Embarrassed Embarrassed Embarrassed Embarrassed
Doh!!!
For a moment, I'd forgotten that SNRM is inversely proportional to synch rate.  In this situation, the higher US SNRM (compared to the previous ISP) implies that the US synch rate is now lower than that provided by the previous ISP.
For whatever reasons on CN20 higher (uncapped) US comes as a chargeable extra.  Does anyone know if this is the same with all ISPs due to the being a (chargeable?) BTw bolt-on?
Embarrassed Embarrassed Lips are sealed Lips are sealed
Plusnet Staff
Plusnet Staff
Posts: 6,346
Thanks: 31
Fixes: 5
Registered: 26-11-2011

Re: Upstream noise margin, dog slow uploads and erratic downloads

Some ISP's (who are a more expensive) have Max Premium included in the price.
It's not specific to an ISP as it's quite easy to place an order with Max Premium enabled but it would push the monthly price up.
On the whole, most customers wouldn't find the need for Max Premium and would rather pay less for not having it, I imagine.
Chris Pettitt
Cloud Environments Engineer
Superuser
Superuser
Posts: 12,608
Thanks: 3,882
Fixes: 25
Registered: 22-08-2007

Re: Upstream noise margin, dog slow uploads and erratic downloads

Hi Chris,
(a bit off thread - sorry)
Welcome back to the DCT / Forums - you've been missed!
Kevin
Plusnet Staff
Plusnet Staff
Posts: 6,346
Thanks: 31
Fixes: 5
Registered: 26-11-2011

Re: Upstream noise margin, dog slow uploads and erratic downloads

Thanks Cheesy
Chris Pettitt
Cloud Environments Engineer