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Upload twice as fast as download speeds - how can this be? -- RESOLVED

40aa5607
Newbie
Posts: 8
Registered: 28-10-2013

Upload twice as fast as download speeds - how can this be? -- RESOLVED

I upgraded today from PlusNet ADSL2+ service to PlusNet UnlimitedFibre.  I'm very fortunate because I live 100m from the exchange and less than 100m from the FTTC cabinet.  However, I'm a bit disappointed and puzzled by my speedtest results and wondered if anyone here has seen this before:
The attached png image shows two speedtest results together with a 'stage-3' BTwholesale speedtester result from http://test3.speedtest.btwholesale.com/PerformanceTesterWS/indexTap3Frames.jsp
The png shows I am getting an UPLOAD speed of around 18Mbps to internet based speedtesters; this is in keeping with what I'd expect from the "Upstream Rate IP profile of 20 Mbps".  This suggests to me my copper is good and the line to the FTTC cabinet has no problems.
The DOWNLOAD speeds of 9 - 24 Mbps are mostly half the upload speeds in these tests and much lower than the IP Profile of 77.44 Mbps.  If congestion caused this then I would expect the upload speeds to suffer from the same congestion.  I'm also inclined to think the speedtest.btwholesale.com system is congested and even rather broken and perhaps ignore it.
Shortly after the BTopenReach engineer departed I was getting a 30Mbps download result from speedtest.btwholesale.com.  I was surprised it wasn't higher as the BT engineer had shown me the line test results of 80/20 Mbps down/up.  So I started to do some more tests to get some screenshots to send to PlusNet to ask why I only seemed to see speeds associated with the LimitedFibre product despite signing up for the Unlimited product.  However, I never saw that earlier 30Mbps speed again and the fibre just seems to sit at around 10Mbps (or less with the BTwholesale speedtester).  I had a similar experience with PlusNet ADSL2+ - I would sync at 21Mbps with the PlusNet modem but only ever see speeds of about 13Mbps almost as if I was being rate limited.
I'm using mtu of 1492 but get similar results with mtu of 1442 - so I don't think MTU settings are the issue.
Desktop PC is plugged directly into Draytek  2910VG router 100Mbps LAN ports; the WAN socket is plugged into the FTTC modem.
A neighbour is speedtesting at 57Mbps but don't know what ISP they are.
I'm not using a PlusNet supplied router so I'll order one tomorrow in order to discount the possibility my router is the limiting factor.
I'm left thinking one of three things are wrong:
a.  either simple congestion (but why so much higher Upload speeds)
b.  or misconfiguration of some form in BT FTTC equipment before routing on the packets to PlusNet backbone
c.  or the PlusNet configurations have me on the wrong product
All I can think to do is to order a PlusNet router to remove the enduser equipment factor.  
Does anyone have any suggestions or explanations?  Thanks.
12 REPLIES
Superuser
Superuser
Posts: 9,136
Thanks: 546
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Registered: 06-04-2007

Re: New to PlusNetFibre - Upload twice as fast as download speeds - how can this be?

It's possible that Plusnet's systems have still to update that you are now on an 80/20Mbps fibre service. The systems are down for maintenance at the moment so not a lot can be done until they are back online at 6am. I suggest letting the Digital Care Team pick this up and take a look in the morning.
David
40aa5607
Newbie
Posts: 8
Registered: 28-10-2013

Re: New to PlusNetFibre - Upload twice as fast as download speeds - how can this be?

Thank you spraxyt, I'll do that.
Thought I'd do some late night speedtests when contention/congestion is probably not a factor.
Results are in attached png because I don't know how to tabulate here.
Results are fairly consistent.  Variation in latency is a surprise, even unbelievable.
Upload is a consistent 17 - 18 Mbps.
Download is much less than this.
How /where should one do a SpeedTest?
Plusnet Alumni (retired) chrispurvey
Plusnet Alumni (retired)
Posts: 5,369
Fixes: 1
Registered: 13-07-2012

Re: New to PlusNetFibre - Upload twice as fast as download speeds - how can this be?

Hi,
I've run a few checks on your line and a phone line fault has been detected, this is the most likely cause of your speed issues.
I've raised this with our suppliers and updated your ticket, we're now just waiting for an update regarding this.
40aa5607
Newbie
Posts: 8
Registered: 28-10-2013

Re: New to PlusNetFibre - Upload twice as fast as download speeds - how can this be?

Thanks.  
Please post the test results with which you concluded there is a line fault.  I don't understand what line fault allows Uploads at the rated maximum but causes Downloads at half that upload speed and almost a 10th of the expected download speed.  It's the same copper.  Do you mean there is a fault in the FTTC (edit: cabinet side) modem?
Plusnet Alumni (retired) chrispurvey
Plusnet Alumni (retired)
Posts: 5,369
Fixes: 1
Registered: 13-07-2012

Re: New to PlusNetFibre - Upload twice as fast as download speeds - how can this be?

The exact results are: (Fault located at exchange (Openreach side of MDF))
No problem with your modem that we can see, it's external to your property.
To progress any broadband fault we need to fix this first, we'll then know if this is the cause as it certainly won't help matters.

40aa5607
Newbie
Posts: 8
Registered: 28-10-2013

Re: New to PlusNetFibre - Upload twice as fast as download speeds - how can this be?

The ticket reply gives more useful information and is very helpful.  It says:
"
Your fault has now been raised with Openreach who we work with on Phone issues for further investigation. They have advised the estimated time for resolution is 31/11/13 [sic] . Please note this is only a estimate and the fault could be resolved before this date, however we will continue to monitor for updates from them and if we are able to provide an update sooner than this we will do so.
**internal**
Fault Type:NDT
Test Results:FU (Fault located at exchange (Openreach side of MDF))
Fault Ref:TR0000003038119
Estimated Resolution Time:31/10/13 23:59:00
"
So hopefully not a line fault to the cabinet but perhaps an exchange side line card.  I'd be interested to hear from anyone who knows how to interpret the **internal** data above.
Hopefully the first 31/11 is a typo for the second 31/10.
and Thank you Chris.  This is the sort of detail/precision and customer service that has impressed me with PlusNet for the past 12 years.
Plusnet Alumni (retired) orbrey
Plusnet Alumni (retired)
Posts: 10,540
Registered: 18-07-2007

Re: New to PlusNetFibre - Upload twice as fast as download speeds - how can this be?

Hi there, should be able to help with that Smiley
NDT = no dial tone
FU = Frames Unit, basically the routing of your line through the exchange (both software routing, i.e. how it's routed through the main BT network, and also hardware including the ports your line is connected to etc). The MDF is the Main Distribution Frame and the fact that it's on the Openreach side means it's a hardware issue on the routing (so wiring somewhere) rather than the software side of things.
Hope that helps it all make a bit more sense?
40aa5607
Newbie
Posts: 8
Registered: 28-10-2013

Re: New to PlusNetFibre - Upload twice as fast as download speeds - how can this be?

Thanks, just saw this.  I'd guessed NDT=no dial tone  - but please note the phone works fine.
The guy from the BT exchange rang earlier to politely say he could find no line fault.  I pointed out that made sense as the Upload speed is close to max so the line seems ok.  I also read out to him the fault message you sent me.  Unfortunately, FU and MDF didn't seem to mean anything to him when I asked.  I have a bad feeling this is already bouncing back to PlusNet.
I'm willing to wait a few days for the PlusNet router to arrive just so we can be sure my own router's not doing something slow when the downlink packets are scanned by the firewall.  (Seems unlikely as my unlimited fibre is now _slower_ than my ADSL was!).  I've also turned off the PlusNet BB firewall just in case.  Note that when the OpenReach engineer left I saw a download speed of 30Mbps to begin with.  This rather implies that nothing at my end is limiting bandwidth because we can know it handled 30Mbps immediately after the FTTC install (but I still want to know where the other 45 Mbps went).
That just seems to leave my FTTC modem, the FTTC cabinet modem or, from what PlusNet Matt says, the wiring to the MDF.  My sense is this is a software/routing or/and linecard issue because I don't see how a wiring fault can allow max upload speeds but poor download speeds (aren't things duplex?).
The latency from the speedtest.btwholesale.com seems high to me = 181.63ms (see attachment).  Could it be most downlink packets are getting lost/dropped at the exchange?
---few minutes later
Well, the speed is creeping up now.  I just took one last speedtest to give you a second latency figure and download speed is now 28.21Mbps (latency still 164.00 ms).  See attachment v2.  So something is changing somewhere since the exchange called.
Plusnet Alumni (retired) chrispurvey
Plusnet Alumni (retired)
Posts: 5,369
Fixes: 1
Registered: 13-07-2012

Re: New to PlusNetFibre - Upload twice as fast as download speeds - how can this be?

We'll need to see the engineer first notes and see where to go from there.
40aa5607
Newbie
Posts: 8
Registered: 28-10-2013

Re: Upload twice as fast as download speeds - how can this be? -- RESOLVED

RESOLVED ---
The PlusNet router came in the post today and the Download speed tests are now excellent and in keeping with the 80/20 Profile.  See attached pngs for before and after with new plusNet router.
I think there have been two (?unrelated?) problems:
1.  Possible fault at exchange which gave Downloads of 11Mbps but still Uploads of 18Mbps. See <before-report-fault-Oct28-2133hrs-BTtest3.PNG>.  This was reported; an engineer from the BT exchange phoned saying no line fault found; I did BT speedtest and demonstrated problem still there; an hour or so later download speed increased to 26Mbps which was about the maximum I had seen when first installed a few days earlier.
2.  It seems most likely my router (Draytek 2910vg) was constraining the _wired LAN_ speed to 26Mps (even with firewall in router disabled).  When this router was replaced by the PlusNet router download speeds jumped to 73Mbps.  See before+after pngs attached.  Please note all testing has been done with a desktop + cat5 cable directly into router.  When I use the PlusNet supplied cables and try the old router again I go back to 26Mbps - so this seems to be a case of User (eqpt) error rather than the TR069 PlusNet stuff doing something fancy and changing some settings in the network.
I hope my experience will be of help to others in their trouble shooting.  I've noticed a few postings on the forum where people have had a good IP profile but were only seeing around 20 - 30 Mbps.  Maybe the WAN port/software routing in some older routers just isn't up to the job.  I'd certainly recommend that people test with a recent design router before chasing PlusNet too hard!
Thank you to everyone who has helped with the trouble shooting.
Community Veteran
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Registered: 30-07-2007

Re: Upload twice as fast as download speeds - how can this be? -- RESOLVED

Quote
It seems most likely my router (Draytek 2910vg) was constraining the _wired LAN_ speed to 26Mps (even with firewall in router disabled).
Very likely. The 2910 isn't shown on Draytek's current comparison list http://www.draytek.co.uk/products/comparison.html but the 2710 shows only a 24Mb throughput capability and there are certainly a couple of other reports out there about the 2910 limiting throughput
http://networkdiary.co.uk/tag/draytek/
http://geekphreek.com/2012/09/draytek-vigor-2910vg-wan-speeds/
40aa5607
Newbie
Posts: 8
Registered: 28-10-2013

Re: Upload twice as fast as download speeds - how can this be? -- RESOLVED

Thanks MisterW.  I see I should have done a search for myself and found your links.
If the speed had stayed at 26Mbps after the fibre install then I would have focused on the router as the easiest thing to trouble shoot.  When the download was half the upload I became a bit more vocal since there was clearly something else wrong too.