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Sync drops when phone rings (subject was "Is this a record?)

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Registered: 10-04-2007

Sync drops when phone rings (subject was "Is this a record?)

Having moved to a new house a month ago I'm just about getting round to sorting out the internet connection which at the moment isn't good.
The router stats noise margin often has these switches from a stable noise margin to a highly variable noise margin (see attached) and then some hours later (or even the next day) goes back to stable with minimal variation. Has anyone seen anything like that before? If it was something like REIN I'd expect it to drop significantly when it became unstable.
Second issue is that the connection drops when there is an incoming call.
The master socket is in a totally useless position in the lounge - not even anywhere near the television.
That brings me to the subject of this post. There are telephone extension sockets in three bedrooms (one of which is my office), the hall, kitchen, dining room and a second socket in the lounge - that's master socket plus SEVEN extensions. I suspect that might have something to do with my problems!

PS I bet my radius graph is a mess!
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
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213 REPLIES
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Re: Is this a record?

Christ! What you have there Sir is an ariel farm  Grin
Get some fresh and start again... ask the local cable/openreach man in a van for some jelly crimps and buy some cat5e and a crone tool etc.
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Re: Is this a record?

Yes jelv, I get that some times when I have to resync/sync - it seems to be one of the nice "features" of 20CN. Others have had similar, I'll find the posts later tonight. That's when it can change - goes "stable" or not, when there is a loss of sync. The interesting thing is if you leave it, there isn't some horrible increase in errors as one might expect, in fact in my experience they can be lower.
Post up the Bits/Tone allocations for each condition when you have it. It won't have anything to do with all your extensions. Just make sure all the wiring is CW1308 and no bell wire. I'll post more later tonight. I've got things to add to the 582n threads as well when I get time to compile it.
Which modem/router are you using at the moment?
Community Veteran
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Re: Is this a record?

Quote from: Anotherone
Just make sure all the wiring is CW1308 and no bell wire

Grin Grin Grin
They are all fully wired at the moment. I'm thinking I'm doing well to hold the IP Profile at 6MB (attenuation is 22.5). The phone is a DECT so I've just tried adding a second filter.
I'm currently trying to work out the possibility of running Cat 5e from the lounge to the office and getting this.
Quote from: Anotherone
Which modem/router are you using at the moment?

Back on the TG582.
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
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Re: Is this a record?

Right, a bit of a delay because I'd forgotten that virtually all my personal examples of this phenomenon were on the drive in my machine that blew up before Xmas. That drive seemed dead last I checked, so I've had to dig.
Most annoyingly I had this very same problem 4 days ago when I connected after being off-line, but I didn't save any Plots. I had to resync twice to get a nice SNRM, it doesn't happen that often thank goodness.
So attached is one graph I dug up from a year ago, and another from last August, but neither as wild a variation as I've had recently or previously, or as you've just had.
Also attached is a Bits/Tone from someone else's line showing a gap with only 2 bits at ~tone193, and my current one with a gap with only 2 bits at tone 126.
Mine is not looking too clever at them moment as there's a lot of bit swapping going on, not shown on the graph. A daytime one looks a lot cleaner. Note the gap at tone 64 is the pilot, tones 211, 252 & 253 are due to broadcast stations.
The gap at tone 193 in the first graph and 126 in the second can be on a different tone at sync, anywhere on the downstream. The closer to the pilot, slightly lower the sync. It's unpredictable and has something to do with an interaction between BDCM chipsets in the modem/router and TI (TSTC) chipset in the 20CN DSLAM.
You will notice that you won't have the gap with a tone only having 2 bits when you have the wild SNRM. A delightful "feature".
Final attachments are my typical SNRM plots, a not perfectly "quiet" day and a night-time.
As far as your wiring goes, if it's all CW1308, well you know the drill - drop the PPP, power down, unplug. Carefully remove wires from terminals 3 & 4 throughout, check you don't have a split pair - ie. make sure Blue+white trace is on 2 and White+blue trace is on 5 throughout.
If you have old cable anywhere the colours would be Blue, Orange,  Green & Brown then it's either a re-wire or filtered faceplate and separate cable to your modem/router location.   What you suggested in  your previous reply would work  but Cat5e is an over-kill, CW1308 will do (unless FTTC is coming) and your suggestion is a sledge hammer to crack a nut if all your existing wiring is CW1308.
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Re: Is this a record?

Update report:
I've now got a long Ethernet cable dangling over the banister so that I can put the router in to the test socket (so the 'aerial farm' is totally disconnected).
Sync is still being lost when the phone rings. I've tried a different filter.
Just got to try a different phone (currently using a DECT phone) and no phone plugged in at all.
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
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Re: Is this a record?

and also, just to round it off my Current Line speed hasn't updated overnight. It's only 500 down so not a great concern.
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
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Plusnet Alumni (retired) orbrey
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Re: Is this a record?

Hi jelv,
I've certainly seen worse radius graphs:
<img src="http://ccgi.psmith12.plus.com/visradius/generated/image13637806059196.png"/>
I've also nudged your profile up to 6500 to match BTs side, hope that helps.
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Re: Is this a record?

Totally disconnected the DECT phone (and unplugged it's power supply) so the only thing connected to the test socket was the router, rang my number and the router lost sync.
OK, time to raise a fault:
Quote

There's been a problem
Please try using the Broadband Troubleshooter again in a short while. If you continue to have problems please contact our Support Team for help.

Angry
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
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Community Veteran
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Re: Is this a record?

Quote from: Matt
Hi jelv,
I've certainly seen worse radius graphs:
<snipped>

This is something I've seen a few times. If the sync is restored quickly the PPP session doesn't drop and it doesn't show on your graph. Can you see a log of the BT sync times?
Quote from: Matt
I've also nudged your profile up to 6500 to match BTs side, hope that helps.

Thanks
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
Broadband: Andrews & Arnold Home::1 (FTTC 80/20)
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Plusnet Alumni (retired) orbrey
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Re: Is this a record?

It has actually raised a ticket for you, so a fault is there on our systems - not sure why the error though. Did it ask you any of the questions at all?
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Re: Is this a record?

I got as far as answering the type of problem to which I selected dropping connection. That was when it when it errored.
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
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Re: Is this a record?

I've added some details to the ticket.
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
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Re: Is this a record?

What is "CLT"?
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
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Plusnet Alumni (retired) orbrey
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Re: Is this a record?

I think it's "Copper Line Test"