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Sync, Profile etc - is my understanding correct?

ciderboy
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Registered: ‎10-05-2011

Sync, Profile etc - is my understanding correct?

A bit of background first:
Last week I started having major problems getting my router to sync.  After logging a call it turns out that I had a 'Battery Contact' fault which was fixed on Wednesday.
When I got home on Wednesday night I was impressed to see that the router was syncing at 5.5Mbps+ (I only used to get around 4Mbps).  However, the router was reporting that my profile was only 3072kbps - this was confirmed by a BT Speedtest (as a maaf customer I'm unable to access the online confirmation in the member centre).
My understanding was that the profile would normally increase in 24-48 hours howewever, despite there being small fluctuations in the sync rate, the profile has remained unchanged at 3072 kbps (both on the router & BT Speedtest).
I've just added a comment to my ticket to ask for this to be looked at but part of me is thinking that my understanding of how it all works is incorrect.
So, can anyone out there confirm that the profile should have increased after two and a half days without disconnections? (apart from one which I've just done through the router interface to see if it made a difference)
Thanks in advance.
21 REPLIES
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Re: Sync, Profile etc - is my understanding correct?

I am puzzled by your statement that the router was reporting that my profile was only 3072kbps as the router doesn't know the profile.
Can you post the full stats from the router
ciderboy
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Re: Sync, Profile etc - is my understanding correct?

Jim,
Ok - that's the first question answered then - my understanding isn't that great  Smiley
It's the "bandwidth" I'm talking about.  Full stats are:
Link Information

Uptime: 2 days, 9:17:38
DSL Type: G.992.5 annex A
Maximum Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]: 756 / 5,168
Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]: 440 / 3,072
Data Transferred (Sent/Received) [MB/MB]: 82.87 / 376.97
Output Power (Up/Down) [dBm]: 12.5 / 19.0
Line Attenuation (Up/Down) [dB]: 26.5 / 45.0
SN Margin (Up/Down) [dB]: 17.0 / 3.5
Vendor ID (Local/Remote): TMMB / IFTN
Loss of Framing (Local/Remote): 1,162 / 0
Loss of Signal (Local/Remote): 655,354 / 0
Loss of Power (Local/Remote): 0 / 0
Loss of Link (Remote): 0
Error Seconds (Local/Remote): 786,438 / 0
FEC Errors (Up/Down): 1,708,798 / 96,697,617
CRC Errors (Up/Down): 5,118 / 8
HEC Errors (Up/Down): NA / NA
Community Veteran
Posts: 38,460
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Registered: ‎15-06-2007

Re: Sync, Profile etc - is my understanding correct?

You are misunderstanding what it says
The current sync speed is 3,072kbps but the best the router thinks could be achieved is 5,168kbps  (I have no idea where that number comes from).
However looking at your stats something is seriously wrong - if nothing else the remarkably high number of upstream FEC errors is a big alarm sugnal
Can you try connecting the router to the test socket and report the stats again
Superuser
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Re: Sync, Profile etc - is my understanding correct?

Presumably as a result of last week's problem almost certainly the DLM has put you on a 1472-3072kbps banded profile which currently restricts your sync speed to 3072kbps. However with your attenuation and for that restricted sync speed I would expect the downstream SN (Signal to Noise Ratio) Margin to be higher than its present value of 3.5dB. I'm not convinced the fault has really been cleared. Oldjim's response has also highlighted other concerns and you do need to confirm the stats when connected via a filter to the test socket.
Is your fault ticket still open? If it is I suggest sending it back querying the lower than expected sync speed and requesting further checks be carried out on your line.
David
David
ciderboy
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Re: Sync, Profile etc - is my understanding correct?

Unfortunately I don't have a test socket.  However, since some problems I had last year (which were eventually fixed by a replacement router) the router is permanently plugged  into the 'main' socket in the house (where the line comes in) and all extensions are disconnected.  I therefore know that any problem is not with my wiring.
So basically, whatever has been done to fix the fault has given me stability at the cost of around a 30% drop in download speeds.  It seems like every time I have a fault on my line the speed drops once it's fixed (around a year ago speed tests reported 5Mbps - currently 2.4Mbps)  Sad
I wouldn't mind but, living near the centre of Bristol, I would have expected better speeds.  Maybe it's BT's way to get people to sign up to FTTP (currently projected for March)  Smiley
The ticket is still open - I've added a comment so I'll see what comes back on that.
Is it likely to be the router again?  The last one only lasted 6 months before it started causing problems (6-7 months ago).
mhb
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Registered: ‎03-02-2012

Re: Sync, Profile etc - is my understanding correct?

Hi ciderboy,
I think you are misunderstanding how Sync speed, BRAS (profile) and actual download speed are related to each other and indeed, the BT speedtester stats. Here is a good explanation.

http://www.kitz.co.uk/adsl/IPprofile.htm
From the router stats you have given, I guess you have a Thomson TG585 router and the 3072 figure you quote is your sync speed, not your profile which would accordingly be 2500kbps. Thus your actual download speed will be less than this, probably around the 2200kbps mark. These figures do seem low given the SNR and attenuation figures you quote and indeed the error figures you quote do seem extrordinarily high.
Incidentally, the test socket refered to is on the master socket and from the way you describe your installation, you are already connected in the right way.
It would seem that there is still a fault on your line which needs to be addressed by a BT engineer visit which Plusnet would need to arrange.
I suggest you phone Plusnet, rather than merely raise a ticket.
 
Community Veteran
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Re: Sync, Profile etc - is my understanding correct?

It appears that he already has a fault ticket running and that is where he proposes to post an update
If so this is the correct route
Boz
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Re: Sync, Profile etc - is my understanding correct?

Quote from: ciderboy
I wouldn't mind but, living near the centre of Bristol, I would have expected better speeds.  Maybe it's BT's way to get people to sign up to FTTP (currently projected for March)  Smiley

Living in the middle of Bristol, I'm surprised that your downstream attenuation is as high as 45dB.
Your local loop must be going around the Centre five times before it reaches the exchange.  Cheesy
Superuser
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Re: Sync, Profile etc - is my understanding correct?

Quote from: ciderboy
So basically, whatever has been done to fix the fault has given me stability at the cost of around a 30% drop in download speeds.  It seems like every time I have a fault on my line the speed drops once it's fixed (around a year ago speed tests reported 5Mbps - currently 2.4Mbps)  Sad

For your sync speed of 3072kbps your IP Profile will be 2710kbps and throughput (download speed) of 2400kbps is about right for that.
Quote from: ciderboy
Is it likely to be the router again?  The last one only lasted 6 months before it started causing problems (6-7 months ago).

I did wonder about the possibility of the router being faulty. How the router works out Maximum Bandwidth is a bit of a mystery but the value reported (5168kbps) seems reasonable for the reported attenuation. In my opinion the actual (banded) sync speed 3072kbps and SN Margin 3.5dB are inconsistent with this, an SN Margin of at least 12dB would be more realistic. Then removing banding would have given a sync speed around the 6000kbps level which you expect.
Anyway, for now see what comes back on the ticket.
David
mhb
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Re: Sync, Profile etc - is my understanding correct?

Ah! I am assuming that ciderboy's profile is still being set on the old system (as is my own - I am also a Madasafish customer myself).  From the stats he quotes this seems more likely to me but I could well be wrong. Hence the difference between our respective interpretation  of the stats quoted.
Replying to oldjim's last post,  I only suggested ciderboy phones support rather than continuing to rely on the ticket system in the light of personal experience. It is difficult to convey all the facts necessary to enable support to help effectively when the communication is only one way at a time, particularly if there is any degree of confusion in the mind of the ticket raiser.
Superuser
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Re: Sync, Profile etc - is my understanding correct?

There are a number of clues in ciderboy's stats that show the connection is on 21CN/ADSL2+
DSL Type:  G.992.5 annex A is ADSL2+
Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]:  440 / 3,072 Upstream sync speed just under 448kbps
Vendor ID (Local/Remote):  TMMB / IFTN Remote Vendor ID IFTN (which is the chipset in Huawei MSANs).
If a full test is done on the BT Performance Tester (http://speedtester.bt.com) an upload test is also carried out on 21CN (whether ADSL1, 2 or 2+).
On 21CN IP Profiles are immediately set to 88.2% of sync speed, though the processes communicating that to Plusnet don't appear to be working properly at the moment. Plusnet round this down to the nearest 100kbps for setting Current line speed. I assume the same system is used for MAAF customers though the value isn't visible in their Member Centre. On 21CN/ADSL2 and 2+ the DLM also has banded profiles at its disposal, one of these being 1472-3072kbps. Indications are that ciderboy's connection has been put on this.
Since a fault ticket is ongoing, responding that way seems appropriate. I tried to provide a few words that could be used/adapted for the response if desired - hopefully brief but to the point and not drawing conclusions based on only a limited view of available data.
Hope this provides useful background. Smiley
David
ciderboy
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Re: Sync, Profile etc - is my understanding correct?

Hi all & thanks for the responses.
I've cheated a bit & added a link to this thread on my ticket whilst trying to explain everything.
Spraxyt - I've experienced a banding problem before (last year when I had problems with the router).  Hopefully this is all that's wrong and it'll get sorted once somebody picks up the ticket again.
I'll let you know how I get on.
mhb
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Re: Sync, Profile etc - is my understanding correct?

Hi spraxyt, thanks for enlightening me on all this. As must now be obvious, I knew very little beyond adsl max, anything more up to date than this is but a distant dream on my tiny rural exchange.
Superuser
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Re: Sync, Profile etc - is my understanding correct?

Quote from: ciderboy
I've cheated a bit & added a link to this thread on my ticket whilst trying to explain everything.

That's fine.
Quote from: ciderboy
Spraxyt - I've experienced a banding problem before (last year when I had problems with the router).  Hopefully this is all that's wrong and it'll get sorted once somebody picks up the ticket again.

We seem to be collecting a number of "could be" explanations, but I did wonder if another fault (dodgy joint?) was present before the battery fault was identified. Possibly the battery fault has been rectified but the other one is still present.
Do you ever hear crackles on the line during phone calls?
David