Router on 24/7 why?

[#1]

Hello new forum. Woop!,

I take it we are still supposed to leave our routers on 24/7 to get the best connection speed.

This does not directly affect me, as other people have noted, turning off the router over night as I am want to do for security/energy consumption/safety reasons, has no appreciable effect on my connection speed.

The problem is my parents (also on PlusNet) will only turn their router on when the computer is turned on; once a day for email and a bit of browsing.  So instead of getting 9 Mb they get 0.225 Mb.  I think the main reason for turning off the router is they feel it gets hot.  As far as I am concerned it does not (you can touch it so it is less than 40°C) but I guess they come from a time when faulty electrics were more problematic.

Does anyone have any advice that might be helpful without re-engineering my parents?

And can someone tell me why BT (a technology company) can't tell the difference between a struggling line and one where the router is turned off?  S

[#2]

routers should be left on 24/7.
can you tell me how BT (and by that you mean openreach) is supposed to tell the difference between someone turning their router on and off (ie just killing the power) and a line problem?

if the end-user does a proper disconnect and turn off then no problem at all, but that's not what your parents are doing, is it?

[#3]

Hi strider,

It's just the case that the equipment used for DLM (dynamic line management) can't differentiate between a disconnection initiated by the customer or the device being powered off.

I understand their concerns and know that some people feel uncomfortable leaving electronic equipment on overnight. I could only advise telling them that routers are devices that are designed to be left on 24/7, that as with any electronic device they may feel warm to the touch but should never present a danger and that by powering it off overnight it will cause the undesirable reduction in speeds that they're seeing.

I realise too that convincing one's parents of such things isn't always straight forward but I'd try broaching it with them in this manner if you haven't already/

[#4]

Have to say, I'm with your parents: I hate having to leave the router on overnight.  Surely it's not beyond the wit of man to let the DLM software know that the router is being deliberately shut down and when it is starting up ..

[#5]

do you leave your fridge on overnight?
do you leave your TV on overnight? (and having it on standby is still on).
do you leave your phone on charge overnight?
do you leave numerous other products on overnight?

bottom line is that the router is far less of an energy or safety issue than numerous other devices that are "powered on" all the time.

[#6]

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@WTF wrote:

Have to say, I'm with your parents: I hate having to leave the router on overnight.  Surely it's not beyond the wit of man to let the DLM software know that the router is being deliberately shut down and when it is starting up ..

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and how is the DLM software to know if the router has been deliberately shut down or not.

all the DLM system is seeing is a dropped connection, it doesn't have a crystal ball that can detect what every individual is doing.

[#7]

How about when the power switch is hit on the router it sends a message to the DLM software telling it that it has been shut down?  When it's powered up it could send another message to say it's now back.

Not exactly rocket science.  You'd think after 40 years an engineer somewhere might have considered the possibility ..

[#8]

maybe that tells you that it's simply not possible if, after "40 years" it still hasn't happened.
but as you say, if it's not rocket science then i'm sure you'll be able to give it a bash.

so essentially what you are saying is that when the power switch is hit and device is turned off, the device (whilst it's turned off) should send a message to DLM saying that it has been turned off.
i'll enjoy reading the schematics you come up with that will enable that to happen.

[#9]

Err .. when I hit the power button on my laptop it doesn't instantaneously turn off, it goes into a whole shutdown process that is WAY more complex than simply sending a shut down signal.  So basically, why shouldn't routers do something similar? If the comms engineers are struggling with the how, have them check out their laptops.

Kinda surprised you couldn't think of that yourself - particularly given the massive clue in the mention of pressing the power button rather than pulling the plug ..

[#10]

@WTF,

What you're talking about is one half of the issue the other would be upgrading every piece of BT Wholesale equipment involved in the DLM process right across the country.

[#11]

Good point, though like I say, they've had 40 years to do it

[#12]

What has been talked about here is the last gasp or dying gasp https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dying_gasp

[#13]

Thanks for the replies.  I'm guessing this has told me what I had exptedted that you need to leave the router on for more than a couple of hours a day.

I'm still miffed as the modem works out the conneciton speed when it connects, why can't the system use that to set the speed, especially as that seems more like a software upgrade than a hardware upgrade.  S

[#14]

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@WTF wrote:

Err .. when I hit the power button on my laptop it doesn't instantaneously turn off, it goes into a whole shutdown process that is WAY more complex than simply sending a shut down signal.  So basically, why shouldn't routers do something similar? If the comms engineers are struggling with the how, have them check out their laptops.

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@strider

This is true, but the difference here between the power button on your laptop and that of the router is one is a 'hard' switch and the other is 'soft', you can tell the difference as the one on your laptop doesn't actually latch when you press it it rises again rather than staying down, with the opposite on your router.

A soft switch initiates a shutdown process as you say then once this is complete the unit switches off. But on your router it is simply a switch to control the flow of the supply, press the switch and you cut the supply, with everything dying in an instant.

I don't think that soft switches are or will be the norm for routers, they may simply not be used as they are meant and expected to be on for long periods of time.

[#15]

I think what is being very simply said is that the lines belong to the ISP and they should know the difference between a fault in their lines and anything the customer is doing at the lines end.

One shouldn't be connected to the other. But I guess the reason it's that way is the cost. Letting the customer do the large part of any fault finding must save a lot of money.

Not many electrical items work around the clock. But things like fridges and central heating etc are actually working doing a job. While the router when unused is just standing idle burning electricity.