cancel
Showing results for 
Search instead for 
Did you mean: 

My ongoing saga...

Agrajag
Grafter
Posts: 74
Registered: 02-09-2013

My ongoing saga...

So, the ongoing saga continues. Symptom: broadband loss of connection and intermittently noisy line. Can be as good as 10 days online or as bad as 1 sync loss and disconnection per hour.
We have now had three separate OpenReach visits.
Visit 1) Broadband engineer. Bypasses the external NTE and installs internal NTE5 with MK3 IFP. All good for a week - then crazy stability again.
Visit 2) Telephone engineer (did I say we also hear clicking on the line around the time we lose broadband)... This engineer like the first tells us how wonderful our line is. Well it does sync at a faster rate than most on our (2011 built) estate. But this is
not helpful when you can lose connection 19 times in one day. He also discovers a "loop" in the line, which he says may be  a bad joint which may be becoming worse in warm weather... He escalates to the UG team...
Visit 3) The UG team arrives the same day. And without looking at anything instantly pooh-pooh the previous engineer claiming there is "no-way" the line could be degraded at this age... and they simply do the same internal line test which says the same as it did the last two times. The line appears to be fine. They say it is probably REIN and we need a broadband engineer and a Woosh test... (not sure this explains the intermittent noise on the line though). They spent a good 30 minutes discussing this of course. Which given my proximity to the PCP being about 100 ft or so, they could have stuck a beeper on my line and checked its connection just to rule that out... but no.
So, to date what have I done?
Rewired the single extension we have.
Switched off the house power.
Forced fridge/freezer motors on/off. CH/HW zone valves activated.
Changed the telephone.
Walked around the house and immediate neighbourhood with an AM radio tuned to 612kHz. Our bedroom TV made a bit of noise (according to an AM radio - old CCFL backlight) so we replaced that.
..and today my broadband connection was mostly down. Again.
There is no pattern. It can happen during the day or at night.
And you know what? Funnily enough, there has been an OpenReach engineer inside our PCP most of the day doing the preliminary wiring for FTTC this makes me wonder if there may be a poor connection in the PCP which is getting disturbed or as the second engineer said becomes high-resistance (well he didn't say high resistance, I said that) in warm weather (it was quite warm today).
However, at no time have OR checked anything other than our property - apart from running a line test.
I look forward to another pointless visit - and the preliminary lecture saying I'll be charged £50 if the fault is in my property. Goodness me, I'd gladly pay £50 for them (or anyone else) to prove (and fix) it.
I'll bet a RADIUS connection graph for today 03/06 will look horrible. It certainly felt that way here. :-(
Andy
17 REPLIES
Community Veteran
Posts: 4,975
Thanks: 372
Fixes: 16
Registered: 10-06-2010

Re: My ongoing saga...

What firmware version does your 582n have?
Agrajag
Grafter
Posts: 74
Registered: 02-09-2013

Re: My ongoing saga...

My stats:
Uptime: 0 days, 1:09:08   
DSL Type: ITU-T G.992.5   
Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]: 434 / 7,418   
Data Transferred (Sent/Received) [MB/MB]: 19.32 / 74.90   
Output Power (Up/Down) [dBm]: 12.2 / 20.6   
Line Attenuation (Up/Down) [dB]: 24.2 / 45.0   
SN Margin (Up/Down) [dB]: 6.2 / 6.9   
System Vendor ID (Local/Remote): TMMB / ---- 
Chipset Vendor ID (Local/Remote): BDCM / TSTC   
Loss of Framing (Local/Remote): 0 / 0   
Loss of Signal (Local/Remote): 1 / 0   
Loss of Power (Local/Remote): 0 / 0   
Loss of Link (Remote): -   
Error Seconds (Local/Remote): 43 / 0   
FEC Errors (Up/Down): 1,639 / 25,431 
CRC Errors (Up/Down): 4 / 733   
HEC Errors (Up/Down): 2 / 20,017
Normally my DS margin is about 9 - but just at the moment I took the above snapshot it dropped... probably ready to lose sync (so typing this quickly!)
Agrajag
Grafter
Posts: 74
Registered: 02-09-2013

Re: My ongoing saga...

Hi ejs,
It has 10.2.2.B - updated that too :-)
I also have the same problems on my Asus N55U router.
Cheers,
Andy
Community Veteran
Posts: 4,975
Thanks: 372
Fixes: 16
Registered: 10-06-2010

Re: My ongoing saga...

582n firmware not a problem then.
The most unusual part of those DSL stats is probably the low upstream speed, which is perhaps not surprising given the line noise. It sounds like you've covered everything already, and need another engineer, to get the intermittent line noise fixed.
Agrajag
Grafter
Posts: 74
Registered: 02-09-2013

Re: My ongoing saga...

Not really sure I want another engineer to my house. It is becoming like groundhog day. I'd rather they offer to do something different - like check their line instead of assuming its our property - which I think, we really have ruled out now. The problem is that each fault seems to be treated like new - with no memory of what has gone before.
:-(
Look at the perfect stability so far today (attached) after yesterday's nightmare... All appliances running in the house the same as yesterday...  Angry
Agrajag
Grafter
Posts: 74
Registered: 02-09-2013

Re: My ongoing saga...

Guys, any chance of a RADIUS connection report from the last few days... ?
Thanks,
Andy
LeeL
Newbie
Posts: 6
Registered: 02-06-2015

Re: My ongoing saga...

Hi Andy,
<img src="http://community.plus.net/visualradius/generated/image14334435083308.png"/><div style="clear:both;"></div>
Your connection seems fine today, asides from the 2 dropouts had within the last hour.
Yesterday however was particularly bad as you can probably tell. Testing on your line this evening shows no issues though.
I have turned Interleaving on which should help with some of the drop outs. If the you find that problems still persist however, please let us know.
Lee
Agrajag
Grafter
Posts: 74
Registered: 02-09-2013

Re: My ongoing saga...

Thanks Lee,
The first broadband engineer did say that interleaving would probably help a little. We don't do the online gaming thing - so latency shouldn't be a big problem.
Will the interleaving have taken effect immediately - or does it take a while to be actioned as we noticed a further disconnection last  night between 10 and 11pm...
Thanks again,
Andy
Plusnet Help Team
Plusnet Help Team
Posts: 4,782
Thanks: 364
Fixes: 136
Registered: 01-01-2012

Re: My ongoing saga...

The order completed early this morning and your connection looks like this so far.

I'd recommend keeping a eye on it.
If this post resolved your issue please click the 'This fixed my problem' button
 Matthew Wheeler
 Plusnet Help Team
Agrajag
Grafter
Posts: 74
Registered: 02-09-2013

Re: My ongoing saga...

Hi Matthew,
I don't think the interleaving has made any difference. Ignore any downtime between 1600 and 2100 last night - this was me re-wiring everything (again). Line seems to be as poor as before - we have had two lost connections so far this morning - and at least one over night.
Is there any way this fault can be escalated? Because openreach have had three visits now - none of which have "seen" a line problem but a problem obviously exists intermittently on the line. The second engineer saw something amiss but his colleagues decided it was not worth pursuing... Now, given all the other changes I have made to try to locate a problem including rudimentary REIN testing surely it is time for more invasive action by OR.
I don't think they've even opened the PCP door to check our line connection - everything has centered on our property.
To make the point once more we do hear occasional noise on the line, the 17070 line test (with phone muted) has faint white noise rising and lowering in amplitude. However, this never happens when the engineer visits of course. 
Just as I was typing the above, and monitoring with routerstats, I saw the margin drop so I grabbed the phone - and white noise crackle is there and some slightly louder white noise pops... Graph attached.
There is clearly an intermittent line problem - but how long is it going to take - and how many more visits for OR to admit and fix the problem...? All the while we suffer periods of poor connectivity.
Andy
Agrajag
Grafter
Posts: 74
Registered: 02-09-2013

Re: My ongoing saga...

So, far I think we have had at least 8 disconnections since the last post. Not terrible, but not good either - given the history I am expecting a "bad day" again very soon now.
Tickets 104034743 and 102633942 refer to openreach visits 1 and 2/3 respectively. Any chance of someone checking the network side of our connection? I have given OR adequate access to our property and they cannot find anything here.  Angry
Thanks,
Andy
Superuser
Superuser
Posts: 10,429
Thanks: 1,912
Fixes: 19
Registered: 22-08-2007

Re: My ongoing saga...

Andy,
Some points to note.
The graphs show a steadily increasing target SNRM and a slower synch.  There is something wrong with the line and the only way to fix that is to have another (hopefully better) engineer come out and inspect things.  It is just the line between you and the exchange which influences synch speed - nothing else.  Something just ain't right here, so I think you'll just need to bite the bullet and get OR back.  Their line fault fix model will always seek to fix from the house back to the exchange - you certainly need that to be the test profile before they leave!
Kevin
Agrajag
Grafter
Posts: 74
Registered: 02-09-2013

Re: My ongoing saga...

Thanks Kevin,
It is a nightmare though... as the "fault" is so intermittent - if it does not show on their tester box they are seemingly not interested. Hence me asking if this can be escalated as there is obviously something awry...
Just changed to ADSL2 from 2+ to see if that will help things be more stable - clutching at straws...
Uptime: 0 days, 1:40:01
    DSL Type: ITU-T G.992.3
    Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]: 994 / 5,746
    Data Transferred (Sent/Received) [GB/GB]: 1.11 / 22.60
    Output Power (Up/Down) [dBm]: 12.2 / 19.8
    Line Attenuation (Up/Down) [dB]: 24.2 / 41.5
    SN Margin (Up/Down) [dB]: 5.2 / 12.1
    System Vendor ID (Local/Remote): TMMB / ----
    Chipset Vendor ID (Local/Remote): BDCM / TSTC
    Loss of Framing (Local/Remote): 88 / 0
    Loss of Signal (Local/Remote): 10 / 0
    Loss of Power (Local/Remote): 0 / 0
    Loss of Link (Remote): - 
    Error Seconds (Local/Remote): 611 / 87
    FEC Errors (Up/Down): 4,964 / 537
    CRC Errors (Up/Down): 23 / 3
    HEC Errors (Up/Down): 14 / 3




Cheers,
Andy
Superuser
Superuser
Posts: 10,429
Thanks: 1,912
Fixes: 19
Registered: 22-08-2007

Re: My ongoing saga...

Hi ANdy,
No if the line is marginal ADSL2 will do better than ADSL2+.  The latter uses a higher range of tones (not used much below 8Mbps) which are NOT likely to be beneficial.
I run about 5.5Mbps @3dB on a more attenuated line than yours.  You presently have a 12dB target SNRM - clear indication that something is not right.
If you have an open fault ticket, then you need CRT assistance here.
Kevin