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High speed broadband Norfolk

Mardler
Rising Star
Posts: 454
Thanks: 10
Registered: 01-07-2012

High speed broadband Norfolk

Would someone at PN please comment.
My exchange is Smallburgh, Norfolk. Various searches late last year showed high speed broadband installation (FTTC) expected this month.
Subsequently, I have found:-
1. Installation put back to September.
2. PN is not on the list of ISPs providing upgraded broadband.
3. I won't get it even if PN was providing it because we are connected directly to the exchange (exchange only).
My biggest concern is 3 because I fail to see the logic (I understand the technology) of providing my mate who lives 3 miles away with fast speed but not me: I'm penalised for living fairly close to an exchange. If I thought I'd get faster speeds I'd leave PN for BT or Sky or (heaven forbid!) Talktalk!
16 REPLIES
Acassim
Grafter
Posts: 1,075
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Registered: 11-06-2007

Re: High speed broadband Norfolk

Hi Mardler
I would say that a great deal of exchange upgrades have suffered a set back in the estimated upgrade planning so while this is somewhat annoying, it is common place unfortunately, if you want some detailed info on the exchange then you can normally find the upgrade planning here.
As for not seeing us on the list of fibre broadband providers, I can assure you what we're able to provide this service wherever a BT fibre service is present so once the exchange has been upgraded and the cabinets installed, we will be able to place and order for this service.
Your third point is worrying and it is a a thorn in my side also. Unfortunately fibre services are only provided to an address which is served by a cabinet between the premises and exchange. If you're close enough to the exchange to have a line all the way through, unfortunately we could be looking to wait something like FTTdp to come along (if it ever does) which is where fibre is pulled up to the telegraph pole where a miniature version of the cabinet equipment is placed in order to provide the fibre service.
Community Veteran
Posts: 380
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Registered: 22-08-2007

Re: High speed broadband Norfolk

In a similar position myself with fibre(FTTC/FTTP) being announced here for December, but only for around 20% of the town, the remaining 80% are Exchange Only lines so its going to leave around 800-1000 without fibre and only around 200 or so who will be able to get fibre,  I am only 300 meters or so from the exchange so when it was announced I was expecting a nice upgrade from 8MB but sadly I have been told it might be the end of 2016 before they will do an upgrade for the EO lines here so it looks like my best option at the moment is the LLU supplier which plusnet are insistant isn't available on my exchange.
Ironic thing is they are busy saying how its going to be a big benefit to business on the exchange here, but nearly all the businesses in this area are exchange only lines!
Community Veteran
Posts: 5,472
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Registered: 11-08-2007

Re: High speed broadband Norfolk

Quote from: Bud
I am only 300 meters or so from the exchange so when it was announced I was expecting a nice upgrade from 8MB but sadly I have been told it might be the end of 2016 before they will do an upgrade for the EO lines here

I am on an 20CN exchange (EAPUR) which will NOT be upgraded to fibre, I recently discovered that like you I appear to be on an EO line.
In Essex, as far as I know, the exchange upgrades are limited to either providing FTTC capability, or raising customers minimum connection speed to 2Mbps by the end of 2016 (which is just pathetic !).  There appears to be no plans for upgrading anyone else, so those of us on less than 8Mbps connections get nothing, despite Essex Council promoting how beneficial having Superfast Broadband is for the community.
I would have thought that the most cost effective way of improving the connection speeds for those who need it most, would be to upgrade all the 20CN exchanges to 21CN ADSL2+.  This wouldn't involve digging up the roads, or laying fibre, or providing power supplies and new road side cabinets, or the fibre to VDSL electronics in the cabinet.
Surely upgrading 20CN to 21CN just involves swapping some interface cards, or perhaps a new connection rack in the telephone exchange,  and the job would be done.
It seems madness that, as in the above case, 80% of connections are EO and can't benefit from fibre, but they would be greatly enhanced by an upgrade to 21CN for a fraction of the upgrade cost compared to the fibre upgrade scheme currently being rolled out !.  However this won't happen under the current BDUK/Council plans. because they will only support schemes that can be part funded by a state aid funding grant from central Government, and that grant only applies where a minimum of "superfast"  (>24Mbps) download speeds will achieved by all customers that choose to take the upgrade - so by definition all 21CN upgrades are excluded.
I haven't read anywhere that there are any plans to retire the remaining 20CN exchange equipment,  so what hope do we have ?
Community Veteran
Posts: 380
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Registered: 22-08-2007

Re: High speed broadband Norfolk

Quote from: purleigh
I would have thought that the most cost effective way of improving the connection speeds for those who need it most, would be to upgrade all the 20CN exchanges to 21CN ADSL2+.  This wouldn't involve digging up the roads, or laying fibre, or providing power supplies and new road side cabinets, or the fibre to VDSL electronics in the cabinet.
Surely upgrading 20CN to 21CN just involves swapping some interface cards, or perhaps a new connection rack in the telephone exchange,  and the job would be done.

Aye, it seems total madness that they don't consider that option, as is only providing around 20% coverage (which I think is just so they can say they are providing it to this area to tick a box).  I have raised this with the local business forum who were totally unaware that the vast majority of their members wasn't going to be able to get fibre broadband.  They came back to me with a claim from the ones administering the BDUK funding that there is to be 30% coverage when its launched, but I suspect they are counting a housing estate with a cabinet at the end of the road which doesn't serve the estate. They wouldn't commit to any time scales apart from near full coverage by December 2016, so I suspect it may be like when they provided ADSL here they didn't have enough backhaul to the mainland.  In that case they had to lease capacity from Thus till they upgraded their links.  At the moment they lease capacity on the Faroes fibre link, supplemented with microwave links, so I guess they are waiting till the new fibre link is in place.
Mardler
Rising Star
Posts: 454
Thanks: 10
Registered: 01-07-2012

Re: High speed broadband Norfolk

Thanks, Adam and the rest of you.
Box ticking appears to be the name of the game and the only explanation for the illogical situation of greater distance from an exchange being a benefit.
Mardler
Rising Star
Posts: 454
Thanks: 10
Registered: 01-07-2012

Re: High speed broadband Norfolk

Bumped.
It's been suggested that, for EO lines, BT is (eventually) putting a cabinet alongside the exchange and hanging all EO lines off that. Seems to make sense.
Also, that EO users should see 20mbps provided BT install ADSL2 with FTTC.
Any thoughts (especially PN?
Community Veteran
Posts: 5,472
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Registered: 11-08-2007

Re: High speed broadband Norfolk

I just found this statement -
State aid SA.33671 (2012/N) – United Kingdom National Broadband scheme for the UK - Broadband Delive...
[quote=Paragraph (50) - page 14]Technological neutrality:
The UK recognises that a mix of technologies will be needed to
deliver superfast broadband throughout the UK. A wide range of technology solutions are
possible to achieve the UK Government's objective, including fixed, fixed-wireless, mobile
and satellite. One technology choice will not be suitable for all circumstances and so, the
UK's approach to delivery remains technology neutral. The UK's view is that the market is
best placed to determine the appropriate mix of technological solutions for a particular
project, whether a local broadband project or a community level one. For instance, where
the costs of deploying fibre technology makes the business case weaker or non existent, the
UK accepts that the selected service provider offers basic or advanced basic broadband
services via satellite, wireless and ADSL2+ broadband technology platforms.
That concerns
areas typically where existing broadband infrastructures do not exist or cannot provide
minimum download speeds of 2 Mbps at affordable prices (i.e. basic broadband "white
areas").
Although I've not seen any commitment to ADSL2+ upgrades in any of the BDUK projects that I have looked at.
Community Veteran
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Registered: 31-08-2007

Re: High speed broadband Norfolk

I'm not sure that putting a Cabinet "alongside" the exchange is a workable solution for EO lines. You need to ask yourself, well why put it just outside, you may as well put it inside. I have a feeling that when I looked at this a while ago, the reason is that the electronics used in a Cab can interfere with other electronics in the exchange and so it has to be away from the exchange. Now, I can't remember any detail or whether that is or was correct or whether such an issue has been overcome.
Even "away" from the exchange, the number of EO subscribers that may be connected to any new cabinet may not be as many as with normal cabinets. So you'll need more (smaller) cabinets to cover a similar number of subscribers - a higher installation cost.
There is another thorn in the side of this upgrade issue seriously disadvantaging people in (semi)rural locations. If a Cabinet in a village say, has the same number of subscribers on it as an urban area cabinet, where does the argument come in that it's not as cost effective to install FTTC for a village? I seriously wonder if it's just down to more people in general, in urban areas making more noise about it.
Community Veteran
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Registered: 10-06-2010

Re: High speed broadband Norfolk

Here's a picture allegedly of some new cabinets right in front of the exchange:
http://community.plus.net/forum/index.php/topic,125736.0.html
I expect the metal casing of the cabinet would provide some shielding. Also the cost isn't just the cost of the cabinet and its contents, the FTTC cabinet needs a fibre optic connection to a nearby exchange.
Community Veteran
Posts: 19,101
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Registered: 31-08-2007

Re: High speed broadband Norfolk

As I said, it was a while ago by which I meant years, and I couldn't remember any detail. I would also have though that a properly installed metal cabinet would have not presented any problems, but hey what do engineers know, the planners are the experts  Roll eyes
Your last comment is a bit obvious, all FTTC cabinets need a Fibre connection to the exchange whether they are urban or rural  Lips are sealed
Community Veteran
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Registered: 22-08-2007

Re: High speed broadband Norfolk

And in my further research for whats going on here with fibre, I notice a planning application has been submitted for an exchange 8 miles away to get a cabinet installed outside it so fingers crossed that's what they might do here as well.
Mardler
Rising Star
Posts: 454
Thanks: 10
Registered: 01-07-2012

Re: High speed broadband Norfolk

Bump
I am in communication with someone who says we'll be on HSB "by the end of the summer". I'll believe that when I see it!
ITM, I just found that ADSL2 is available at the end of the month.
The BT Open Reach site now shows the Smallburgh exchange as being enabled but it cannot verify for my address. (I am not getting HSB.)
Questions for PlusNet:-
1. Will I be upgraded automatically?
2. Is this likely to be the end of it for us i.e. we get ADSL2 but not HSB?
TIA
Community Veteran
Posts: 38,460
Thanks: 1,027
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Registered: 15-06-2007

Re: High speed broadband Norfolk

Upgrade to ADSL2+ should happen automatically but slowly
I suggest checking here http://www.dslchecker.bt.com/adsl/ADSLChecker.TelephoneNumberOutput and when it says ADSL2+ is available contact Plusnet
I recommend removing the link from your post as it gives your full telephone number
Mardler
Rising Star
Posts: 454
Thanks: 10
Registered: 01-07-2012

Re: High speed broadband Norfolk

Thx Oldjim, link removed.