FTTC / VDSL2 trial

[#1]

Quote from: manastro

Don't forget there is also a major cost implication in having to install millions of fibre to copper converters in every property, unless someone starts making fibre optic routers and telephones for the home market.

Much work has already been completed on this.  A suitable home install 'gadget' is in trial with a target price of $10.   I'll see if I can dig out a progress report on where its at.

Quote

Even if BT only install the FO cable into the house, it is an awful waste of FO capacity to run only one line down it. It simply doesn't make economic sense.

True in the short term.  But taking the long view of providing 'High Speed Broadband' there is a payback.  The debate is really on just how to manage the 'splits',  GPON has a way to go to meet all the needs - but is evolving rapidly particularly in the remote management of fault diagnosis.
Note:  Even this Wiki entry for GPON can be a bit difficult to follow - but it is good general background.
Maurice
Moderator's Note: Fixed link - David (spraxyt)

[#2]

I understand that using a fibre just for telephone and basic internet access maybe a waste - but then it gives so much more like very wide bandwidth TV - if BTw could add more switching / transmission at the local exchanges - but such equipment is so much more compact and cheaper than it once was.
BT would then be able to properly compete with Virgin media and Sky.
As Maurice  says the FO/data / telephone interfaces are simple technology and in the huge volume very cheap.
But I expect BT know all this of course and have plans - as yet unannounced.
i just wish I could get even the announce Fibre to a street cabinet - but being in the country - am unlikely to get it for a few years. maybe I'll just have to move to Edinburgh.

[#3]

No mention has been made of those areas that already have FO that some years ago BTW had to run copper to get BB to those homes. I wonder what's going to happen in those areas?

[#4]

A tactical blunder by BT.  They decided to use a distribution method called TPON - only designed to carry Telephony traffic!  Yup!  It's got the fibre, but the wrong bits of kit at either end.  It would be a very disruptive migration to change that situation notwithstanding the cost implications
M

[#5]

Has BT the freedom to do what it want to do? In the past, many many years ago, BT did what to put a fibre network in to supply a TV service but I believe OFCOM (OFTEL) stepped in and put a stop to it to allow competitors to enter, which was cable. I believe to receive a service which some users are asking for you have 2 choices.
1. Allow a monoply to control the infrastructure.
2. State ownership of the infrastructure.

[#6]

Quote from: itsme

2. State ownership of the infrastructure.

Just what the Australian government has recently done following years of 'debate and foot dragging' with Telstra the main telecoms incumbent.  An aggressive 8 year plan to deliver across ALL of Australia.
M

[#7]

I see my exchange glossop is in the new list - well if you are are going to make it avail from there/trial then id be up for it.

[#8]

I'm waiting on the dates of when each exchange and then from there when each cabinet at each exchange will be done but once we know I expect we'll begin the process of recruiting more triallists so I'd suggest for now to keep an eye on the Community SIte. I expect we'll also email people as and when the exchanges get done too.

[#9]

PN tweeted that the first FTTC customer was online a few days ago.  Is it too early for any speed results?

[#10]

dave i will go halfs with you on bribe to openreach to enable are exchange 

[#11]

I have it on completely unreliable information that our exchange might be within the next batch of exchanges... well that's what I bribed them to do anyway. I'll let you know as soon as I know. I can see the green cabinet out of my bedroom window it's that close and it's dedicated to the group of flats here.

[#12]

I do have to question is it worth all the investment of FFTC when the end user (well retail customers) will see little or any benefit? With the present systems what your sync speeds are have very little to do with how fast you can receive data. Everything is so throttled to death you really only need 8 meg at the most.

[#13]

It's a bit of a Chicken and Egg situation!  The whole infrastructure needs to be reviewed and [probably] restructured to allow significant change to happen.
What can be said is that the days of copper other than at the periphery of the network are definitely numbered.  Technology has already stretched the capacity of what can be achieved over copper well beyond that which can reliably be delivered over more than a few kilometres.  cf the ADSL2+ trials and 21 CN rollout - OK for some urban environments but absolutely no use for rural or even the  'edges' of many urban environments.
The capacity of fibre delivery on the other hand is still being enhanced.  1.9 Terabits per second is currently being tested on 80 Km segments - OK so not in commercial use yet, but not far off for real high capacity backbone delivery. 
But!  It is going to cost.  Pandering to the current entrenched commercial interests of the existing suppliers is unlikely to move us very far forward - they have a lot of investment in the 'old' network and would prefer to migrate slowly.  It will take a brave Government decision to grasp the nettle and take control of this vital infrastructure component if we as a nation are to maintain a position in the Digital World.  Residential broadband delivery is only one component of what we need to be capable of delivering a  solid technological future for generations to come.
Maurice

[#14]

Hi,
Our second FTTC customer went online this evening, there are 6 more who are on the enabled exchanges, whose cabinets are ready and have already expressed an interest in the trial who I'll be contacting in the next week or so once we've completed our router testing.
The purpose of the initial phase of the trial is to get a few customers up and running, see what speeds they get, see what the technology is like, test out a few different routers etc.
For these first few in the learning stage we're not overly concerned about their usage, I've spoken to them both about this already and suggested they might want to test out HD streaming and other high bandwidth applications, they'll both be on BBYW Pro and we've given them some free usage too so they don't have to worry about any extra charges and they can see what the faster speeds will do too.
Looking forward we are thinking about plans for FTTC products but at the moment no pricing has been released from BT Wholesale which makes it difficult at this stage to decide what we'll actually do in terms of product design including the kinds of speeds and usage that would be included.
We've already seen an uplift in usage from customers going on ADSL2+ (we did with Max too) so we're expecting an uplift in usage on FTTC too. How much though is difficult to say. Both of our triallists have gone from sync'ing below 6Mbps to above 20Mbps (I've not got the exact figures to hand) which is quite an increase. That sort of change not just gives plenty of bandwidth for iPlayer in HD (or similar) but allows people to do multiple HD streams and download files, play games, etc. all at the same time.
How many households now have more than 1 PC? And with set top boxes like the new BluRay player that does YouTube and other things and boxes on the way that will do iPlayer, speeds from FTTC will let people do all those things at the same time. For me that's where the big growth in usage will be, sure some people will want the fastest speeds for P2P and other downloads but the right product design can shift a lot of that overnight. It's the how much the interactive and streaming traffic will change that's the interesting question.

[#15]

Thanks for the update Dave.
I can't wait for my exchange to go live (it's in the recently announced batch).  Even with ADSL2+ my line will only sync reliably at under 4Mbps.

James