Showing results for 
Search instead for 
Do you mean 

Close to resolution i think but need advice

Community Veteran
Posts: 19,085
Thanks: 419
Fixes: 21
Registered: ‎31-08-2007

Re: Close to resolution i think but need advice

Oh my gawd, let me just have a re-read. Sorting out the wiring will be cheaper than £10 it's free, back in a mo.
Grafter
Posts: 32
Registered: ‎03-11-2009

Re: Close to resolution i think but need advice

thankyou mate  Smiley if you want better pics let me know and I'll ferry out the SLR and flash.
Community Veteran
Posts: 19,085
Thanks: 419
Fixes: 21
Registered: ‎31-08-2007

Re: Close to resolution i think but need advice

Are you able to follow the wires enough just to confirm image 40 (reply #43) is the first in the chain from the Master Linebox, and it the goes finally to the one in reply #41 (image 39) ?
The photo of the Master Linebox isn't 100% clear, but it looks as though just Blue-white & White-blue are connected to terminals 2 & 5. Please confirm.
The type of connector on the Linebox and on the socket image 39 are called IDC (Insulation Displacement Connector). When connecting to these the wire with insulation is just pushed into place, you need to be careful that you don't open up the jaws of the terminal, it is best to get a small IDC tool, plastic ones available cheap at places like Maplins, B&Q prices between 60p and £1.50 ish (sometimes it's called a krone tool).
more in a mo
Grafter
Posts: 32
Registered: ‎03-11-2009

Re: Close to resolution i think but need advice

confirm image 40 first in chain before going to final. Got a punch in tool as well luckily. 2 and 5 also correct on master image.
Grafter
Posts: 10,540
Registered: ‎18-07-2007

Re:Close to resolution i think but need advice

Hi all, looks like this is all in hand at the moment. Very little we could input, not having much experience with socket wiring Wink but if you need anything please shout up or drop me a PM, ta.
Grafter
Posts: 32
Registered: ‎03-11-2009

Re: Close to resolution i think but need advice

thanks orbrey for keeping tabs, I've had only one disconnect since going back into the test socket so I think this is proof hopefully enough that its the darn wiring.
The only other point of note is that my SNR drops as it goes dark. from 6db down to 2ish. Is that something that can coincide with time of day ? (I'm guessing street lighting and everyones electrics kicking in generates inteferance ?)
Community Veteran
Posts: 19,085
Thanks: 419
Fixes: 21
Registered: ‎31-08-2007

Re: Close to resolution i think but need advice

The drop in SNRM at night is mainly due to MW propagation, there maybe some effects from lighting, it is par for the course on longer especially rural lines which are overhead. Back in a minute on the wiring. You'll need a pair of wire cutters (side-cutters ideally). I'll explain why.
Community Veteran
Posts: 19,085
Thanks: 419
Fixes: 21
Registered: ‎31-08-2007

Re: Close to resolution i think but need advice

OK here we go. In case you haven't checked, using a corded phone & filter just check the other 2 sockets are dead in case something is connected where it shouldn't be.
Then, on the Master front plate, gently check that the wires on 2 & 5 are not fractured at the terminals and are in position correctly, if they aren't you have to remove whichever, trim off the broken bit and remake with the punch down tool.
On the last socket, the wires on 2 & 5 should be Blue-white on 2, White-blue on 5. So remove the Orange wires and the incorrectly placed White-blue and refit the White-blue to 5. Coil up the Orange-white & White-orange wires to the back of the cable out of the way ensuring no bare bits can contact anything. Refit socket to box.
On the intermediate one with the screw terminals, loosen the screws and remove all the wires. Cut off any bare ends from any wires except the Blue-white & White-blue on both cables. Coil up the other wires out of the way as before.
Trim the bare bits on the Blue-white & White-blue wires so they are just long enough to go into the connector without bare bits showing (not too short - re-strip if needed). The wires should go under the small metal strip in the connector where they don't get chewed by the screw (if present on a decent socket). Note this socket hasn't got IDC terminals, which is why the wire ends should be bare.
Fit both Blue-whites to 2 and gently tighten the screw to secure. The same with the White-blues on 5.
Now this socket is an old style master, which has a capacitor and resistor that you don't want (or need).
The capacitor is the yellow sausage device marked C1 horizontally above the plug socket and the resistor is marked R1 to it's left in the picture. Cut both off by their wires using your cutter and remove them.
The device on the RHS is a Surge suppressor and can be left in place.
OK check the wires are secure, neat and tidy and refit the socket to the box.
Are you home between say 9.00am and 3.30pm.? As I wouldn't recommend removing your router and reconnecting the master except during these times to ensure you get the best sync. Remember to powerdown the modem/router and wait several minutes before unplugging the line/filter from the test socket.
Refit the master, then with a corded phone and filter, check that all sockets work ok.
If all ok, plug your router into the filter at the desired location and power up.
Post back stats taken immediately after sync.
Community Veteran
Posts: 25,453
Thanks: 73
Fixes: 1
Registered: ‎10-04-2007

Re: Close to resolution i think but need advice

Quote from: jelv
Hopefully Chris (Anotherone) will be around sometime today - he's the expert on this (hence the nickname (Alex Bell) given to him by ASBO).

I told you he was the expert!
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
Broadband: Plusnet Unlimited Fibre (55/10)
Line rental: Pulse 8 Home Line Rental (£13/month)
Plusnet Complaints Code of Practice
Complain to OFCOM
Plusnet Community
Speed Wave
Grafter
Posts: 32
Registered: ‎03-11-2009

Re: Close to resolution i think but need advice

Hi guys, sorry I've been away for a while to provide an update. I've made a note of what to do re: wiring but I've left it alone since we last spoke to ensure there was time to bed in properly in the test socket. My speeds have since dropped from 2mb to 1mb and these are my router logs over that period. Just a bit unsure why there are lots of auth drops but not many losses of sync !?
Tue, 2009-11-17 13:19:35 - Receive NTP Reply from time-g.netgear.com
Thu, 2009-11-19 00:58:54 - LCP down.
Thu, 2009-11-19 00:59:01 - Initialize LCP.
Thu, 2009-11-19 00:59:01 - LCP is allowed to come up.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:00:02 - Initialize LCP.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:00:02 - LCP is allowed to come up.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:01:02 - Initialize LCP.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:01:03 - LCP is allowed to come up.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:02:03 - Initialize LCP.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:02:03 - LCP is allowed to come up.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:03:04 - Initialize LCP.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:03:04 - LCP is allowed to come up.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:04:05 - Initialize LCP.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:04:05 - LCP is allowed to come up.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:05:05 - Initialize LCP.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:05:05 - LCP is allowed to come up.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:06:06 - Initialize LCP.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:06:06 - LCP is allowed to come up.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:07:07 - Initialize LCP.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:07:07 - LCP is allowed to come up.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:08:07 - Initialize LCP.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:08:07 - LCP is allowed to come up.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:09:08 - Initialize LCP.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:09:08 - LCP is allowed to come up.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:10:09 - Initialize LCP.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:10:09 - LCP is allowed to come up.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:11:09 - Initialize LCP.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:11:10 - LCP is allowed to come up.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:12:10 - Initialize LCP.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:12:10 - LCP is allowed to come up.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:13:11 - Initialize LCP.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:13:11 - LCP is allowed to come up.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:14:06 - Loss of synchronization :28
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:14:12 - Initialize LCP.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:14:12 - LCP is allowed to come up.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:14:58 - CHAP authentication success
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:22:36 - Loss of synchronization :29
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:31:28 - LCP down.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:31:35 - Initialize LCP.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:31:35 - LCP is allowed to come up.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:32:35 - Initialize LCP.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:32:35 - LCP is allowed to come up.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:33:36 - Initialize LCP.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:33:36 - LCP is allowed to come up.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:34:37 - Initialize LCP.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:34:37 - LCP is allowed to come up.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:35:37 - Initialize LCP.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:35:37 - LCP is allowed to come up.
Thu, 2009-11-19 01:35:41 - CHAP authentication success
Fri, 2009-11-20 11:19:35 - Send out NTP request to time-g.netgear.com
Fri, 2009-11-20 11:19:41 - Receive NTP Reply from time-g.netgear.com
Mon, 2009-11-23 09:19:41 - Send out NTP request to time-g.netgear.com
Mon, 2009-11-23 09:19:46 - Receive NTP Reply from time-g.netgear.com
Mon, 2009-11-23 15:11:03 - LCP down.
Mon, 2009-11-23 15:11:09 - Initialize LCP.
Mon, 2009-11-23 15:11:09 - LCP is allowed to come up.
Mon, 2009-11-23 15:12:10 - Initialize LCP.
Mon, 2009-11-23 15:12:10 - LCP is allowed to come up.
Mon, 2009-11-23 15:12:40 - CHAP authentication success
Tue, 2009-11-24 10:38:10 - LCP down.
Tue, 2009-11-24 10:40:52 - Initialize LCP.
Tue, 2009-11-24 10:40:52 - LCP is allowed to come up.
Tue, 2009-11-24 10:40:52 - Loss of synchronization :30
Tue, 2009-11-24 10:41:53 - Initialize LCP.
Tue, 2009-11-24 10:41:53 - LCP is allowed to come up.
Tue, 2009-11-24 10:41:56 - CHAP authentication success

Any thoughts ?
Highlighted
Community Veteran
Posts: 25,453
Thanks: 73
Fixes: 1
Registered: ‎10-04-2007

Re: Close to resolution i think but need advice

As you are on a Netgear I wonder if it might be worth looking at your routers PPP log.
To activate it you need to go to http://192.168.0.1/setup.cgi?todo=ppp_debug
To view the log go to http://dg834/ppp_log
You might get more information about why it dropped.
In there you will see a lot about when it tries to authenticate, it inludes a line that will look something like:
rcvd [CHAP Challenge id=0x99 <8def69ee034c04926e723394ee7ab328>, name = "PTN-AG2"]

so you will be able to see which gateway you tried to authenticate to.
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
Broadband: Plusnet Unlimited Fibre (55/10)
Line rental: Pulse 8 Home Line Rental (£13/month)
Plusnet Complaints Code of Practice
Complain to OFCOM
Plusnet Community
Speed Wave
Grafter
Posts: 32
Registered: ‎03-11-2009

Re: Close to resolution i think but need advice

Now that is a handy tip ! heres the gateway info jelv
rcvd [CHAP Challenge id=0x93 <5b7b92037b411274c061c07b982df856>, name = "pcl-ag01"]
Community Veteran
Posts: 25,453
Thanks: 73
Fixes: 1
Registered: ‎10-04-2007

Re: Close to resolution i think but need advice

Have a look at the log the next time it fails and see what errors there are - I wondered if it was failing on a particular gateway.
At some stage you will need to disable the logging (after a few days because I'm not sure if the log cycles or if you could fill up it's memory and slow it down) - a reboot of the router does this so if you reboot for any reason and still want to look at the log you will need to enable it again.
Did you notice that that the first chap challenge shows you which BT RAS your connection goes through?
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
Broadband: Plusnet Unlimited Fibre (55/10)
Line rental: Pulse 8 Home Line Rental (£13/month)
Plusnet Complaints Code of Practice
Complain to OFCOM
Plusnet Community
Speed Wave
Grafter
Posts: 32
Registered: ‎03-11-2009

Re: Close to resolution i think but need advice

Cheers Jelv would this be the RAS identifier ? ERX24.Manchester4
Community Veteran
Posts: 25,453
Thanks: 73
Fixes: 1
Registered: ‎10-04-2007

Re: Close to resolution i think but need advice

Yup that's it. Your connection goes from your exchange to Manchester, then down to the Plusnet gateways in London
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
Broadband: Plusnet Unlimited Fibre (55/10)
Line rental: Pulse 8 Home Line Rental (£13/month)
Plusnet Complaints Code of Practice
Complain to OFCOM
Plusnet Community
Speed Wave