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Broadband Speed

AVC
Dabbler
Posts: 13
Registered: 13-08-2015

Broadband Speed

I recently moved from an LLU provider to Plusnet.
With the LLU I had a constant, and reliable 1.3Mbps connection, no disconnections and no issues.
I have been with Plusnet about a week, and after having a steady 1.2Mbps connection for a few days, I now have an unusable 574kbps connection.
I have the same copper line and same router as before, so I hope that there is a simple reason for this.
Could someone kindly look into this, otherwise, I may just give up and resort to using a carrier pigeon  Cry
17 REPLIES
Superuser
Superuser
Posts: 11,063
Thanks: 2,419
Fixes: 21
Registered: 22-08-2007

Re: Broadband Speed

Hi AVC,
There's a number of reasons why things might be different - PlusNET uses BTw equipment which operates differently to that used by LLU providers.  That said the current speed does sound very poor.  As a first step, can you please look at the speed issues thread and post the requested data.  See link below.
Is there noise on the opine line?  Dial 17070 option 2.
Plusnet Staff
Plusnet Staff
Posts: 17,641
Thanks: 535
Fixes: 159
Registered: 05-04-2007

Re: Broadband Speed

If the loop loss is showing correctly then you're lucky to get broadband at all if I'm brutally honest. I'm hoping that it's an erroneous reading and there's a fault/issue causing it.
Can you ensure the router is plugged in to the master socket (test socket would be better) without any extension leads in use. Check for noise on the phone line as Townman suggests too.
Loop loss: 81.5db
SNR margin: 1.6db
Speed: 573kbps
Indicative Line Quality:  R 
Mean Time Between Errors Downstream (Seconds):  4 
If this post resolved your issue please click the 'This fixed my problem' button
 Chris Parr
 Plusnet Staff
Superuser
Superuser
Posts: 11,063
Thanks: 2,419
Fixes: 21
Registered: 22-08-2007

Re: Broadband Speed

Those stats are grim indeed and there's nothing brutal about that statement.  If the attenuation is correct any ADSL service at all is astounding!
AVC
Dabbler
Posts: 13
Registered: 13-08-2015

Re: Broadband Speed

81.5db is as good as it gets, but the SNR will range from 6db to 1db depending on time of day.
The router is connected to the master socket as it's the only socket in the house.
Like I said, with TalkTalk I never had a single issue, and had a constant and reliable 1.3Mbps connection.
It's beginning to sound like switching to Plusnet was a HUGH mistake for me.
No noise on the line by the way.
Superuser
Superuser
Posts: 11,063
Thanks: 2,419
Fixes: 21
Registered: 22-08-2007

Re: Broadband Speed

Hi AVC,
I think its not quite so much as switching to specifically to PlusNet, rather it might be switching to a BT WBC product.
In some areas BTw only offer 20CN (ADSL1) services whereas LLU operators such as Sky and TalkTalk can offer ADSL2 on their equipment.  In some areas their LLU equipment has different error management equipment.
Do you know if you are on a 20CN or 21CB service?  See here - http://www.kitz.co.uk/adsl/adslchecker.php - what's available on your exchange and how far you are from it.
Community Veteran
Posts: 5,057
Thanks: 426
Fixes: 16
Registered: 10-06-2010

Re: Broadband Speed

I think it must be connected using ADSL2/2+ based on the speed (not being a multiple of 32), and if that loop loss figure is the downstream attenuation, for the value reported not being limited to 63.5.
There will also be differences in performance between the BT and LLU DSLAMs in the exchange, in much the same way as there are differences in ADSL performance between different modem/routers.
Did you also switch to a Plusnet router?
AVC
Dabbler
Posts: 13
Registered: 13-08-2015

Re: Broadband Speed

21CN, connecting using ADSL2+.
Nope, not a PlusNet router, a Billion router, which is the same router I used with TalkTalk.
The reason I find this all bemusing, is that I am using the same router, the same line to the exchange, and the same service/standard as with TalkTalk.
I'm not expecting miracles, as I have a long line, just the same speed(ish) as I was getting with TalkTalk.  I don't think that is too much to ask, do you?
Community Veteran
Posts: 5,057
Thanks: 426
Fixes: 16
Registered: 10-06-2010

Re: Broadband Speed

No, it's not to much to ask, although other forum users can only look at the information you provide to try and determine what the difference is, or just speculate as to what might have changed.
Certain BT(wholesale) exchange equipment operates long lines as ADSL2+, even when they would be better off connecting using ADSL2. Most equipment makes the switch automatically, but some doesn't. However, considering the length of the line and previous speed, that is unlikely to be the issue and probably wouldn't make a difference anyway.
The Dynamic Line Management (DLM) tends to be most active in the first 10 days, and after that it does continually monitor the line and may make adjustments at any time. Personally I've found the DLM to be pretty keen at switching off interleaving. I suppose it's possible that the DLM found the line to be so stable for those first few days at 1.2Mb, that it then decided to switch off interleaving. Interleaving makes the line more stable, but does increase latency. But interleaving doesn't usually make much difference to the line speed itself, higher or lower. And lines usually start with interleaving off, and then the DLM turns it on if necessary.
Either of those two possible-but-unlikely scenarios could be checked for by looking at the full ADSL stats from your router.
Another possibility, but again, it's unlikely, is that something that was done in the exchange when disconnecting your line from the LLU equipment and connecting it to the BTw equipment has somehow made it worse.
Superuser
Superuser
Posts: 11,063
Thanks: 2,419
Fixes: 21
Registered: 22-08-2007

Re: Broadband Speed

Hi AVC,
Have you raised a formal fault report on this yet?  If not please use the link below to do so.
CRT seem a bit overwhelmed with forum posts at present, so I'd back two horses here!
AVC
Dabbler
Posts: 13
Registered: 13-08-2015

Re: Broadband Speed

OK, so I contacted technical support, who said my IP Profile had been banded, and I needed to wait 72 hours.  So, I waited over 72 hours, contacted technical support again, and they said my speed would improve in 4 hours.
I waited overnight, and my speed was still 575kbps, so I restarted my router, and as if by magic, my speed magically increased to 576kbps, I was AMAZED!!!!!!
I contacted technical support again, and was told there was nothing they could do for 2 weeks!!!
I have only been with Plusnet for 2 weeks, and I am at the point of losing what little hair I have left.
To make matters worse, I just checked the Plusnet speed checker and got the attached result, I nearly had a little accident as I laughed so much  Grin
I have also attached my latest router stats.
In all honesty, I am going crazy with all this  Crazy
Community Veteran
Posts: 5,057
Thanks: 426
Fixes: 16
Registered: 10-06-2010

Re: Broadband Speed

Is the 81.5 dB attenuation about the same as what it was when you were on TalkTalk?
I'm not really sure where the 72 hours or 2 weeks you were told originate from. Probably they wanted to see how stable it was before or after removing the banding. If Plusnet did a reset to remove the banding, it looks like it didn't work.
If you raise a fault, that will probably lead to sending an engineer to your house to check things from there. If really nothing has changed, there may not be much the engineer can do, but they might find something to fix or improve.
Other than sending an engineer, the only other thing I can think of is for them to removing the banding and set custom DLM thresholds such that the line will never be banded and the target SNR margin won't increase despite the terrible error rate.
AVC
Dabbler
Posts: 13
Registered: 13-08-2015

Re: Broadband Speed

Yes, 81.5 dB attenuation was the same with TalkTalk, and my SNR would drop as low as 1, but I wouldn't get many dropouts if any.
This is why I'm confused, as all the router stats look the same as with TalkTalk, and the line is the same, so I can only assume it's the equipment at the exchange?
The 2 weeks comes from a conversation with tech support this morning. The said that even if the requested it, BT wouldn't remove the banding until after 2 weeks, which seems bizarre to me.
My biggest concern is the lack of information from Plusnet, I just keep getting told to give it this many hours, or this many days, but nothing seems to change.
Superuser
Superuser
Posts: 11,063
Thanks: 2,419
Fixes: 21
Registered: 22-08-2007

Re: Broadband Speed

Hi,
I find it very difficult to understand the advice you've been given.  You are on adsl2 and any profile changes should be applied within hours, not days and certainly not weeks.
Have you used the automated fault reporter or did you speak with the support desk?

@CRT, can you please review this thread?  PlusNet's profile seems seriously wrong.
AVC
Dabbler
Posts: 13
Registered: 13-08-2015

Re: Broadband Speed

Spoken to tech support again, and asked them to double check that the banding had been removed yesterday, only to be told that it hadn't.  When I asked, as it hadn't been removed, that they remove it this time, I was told there was no point and I would have to wait until the fault department looked into the issue and that it could take up to 9 days!!!
I'm confused why they couldn't just try removing the banding, and seeing what happened, while they looked into this further.
I just seem to be going around in circles and getting nowhere.  If it takes 9 days, it will be 3 weeks since I moved from TalkTalk, and had a pretty useless connection, and I'm missing out on my Netflix binges  Cry
Maybe I'm just not asking the right questions, or explaining myself correctly when I speak to them?