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ADSL very slow - Plusnet response matching it.

FIXED
Mikeyorks
Hooked
Posts: 6
Fixes: 1
Registered: 11-08-2017

ADSL very slow - Plusnet response matching it.

I'm the last but one property on the end of 7km of old and patched copper in an isolated rural area. Was promised up to 1Mb when I moved here (from 75Mb fibre - also with PlusNet) some 2 years ago. For the first 6 months the ADSL ran at 0.7Mb and I actually got used to it. Then this area was very wet in the 2015 Winter and things went downhill rapidly - all the local connections being in verge side holes in the ground doesn't help.

Poor phone line / no phone line and related Broadband issues resulted in many engineer visits. The set up at this property always came out with a clean bill of health but the Broadband speed was regularly down at 0.13Mb ........... which borders on unuseable. A variety of 'resets' generally got the speed back to around 0.5Mb - but never back to the halcyon days of 0.7Mb.

Clearly tired of me whingeing about it one of the PlusNet technical guys rang me just over a year ago and, at some length, made it clear that the local line infrastructure created a situation that variability was inevitable and anything around the 0.5Mb figure was the best achievable. I had little choice but to accept that. I'd already looked at satellite (frying pan into expensive fire) and wireless via 'line of sight' (trees in every direction there's a mast) and discounted both.

Since then, except on a couple of occasions,  I've mainly been able to reboot the router and pick up a better speed within 24hrs of a dip and mainly been getting circa 0.35Mb ........... without overly disturbing PlusNet!

Until just over a couple of weeks ago when - after heavy rain - I noticed the Broadband was virtually unuseable at 0.13Mb and refused to respond to several reboots of the router. Rang PlusNet and spent 30mins waiting on an increasingly crackly line. So no surprise to be told it was a line fault. The Question raised has never been 'signed off' by BT but I know an engineer worked on it 31st July and again 2nd Aug. Despite that being unacknowledged on the Question, it is clear the line has been fault free since then. But the Broadband speed remains a pathetic 0.13Mb

It was (following a reset I asked for) at 0.23Mb until my last conversation with PlusNet technical, 3 days ago. When they changed some exchange settings - and the speed dipped back to 0.13Mb minutes later - where it has remained since. I've just spent 40 mins on the phone (30 wait + 10 might as well have been 'wait') and more or less been told the technical team will get round to it ............ when they get round to it.

Two questions, please.

1. How do I get some meaningful action from PlusNet. We've been here many times, in the first year, and a reset has always worked in the end analysis. But it does appear to be down to the expertise of whoever does it - drawing on my remembrance of several failures in the past.  And

2. How do I convince PlusNet that I do understand the local infrastructure is the bête noire. But if they wish to use that as the excuse for poor speed and other inconsistencies .............. then that should equally be the default when there is an issue. And not 'please plug into the test socket for 3 days' etc etc etc. Perhaps I'm feeling a bit sensitive at the attempted blackmail of 'an engineer will cost you £55 if no fault found' being uttered for the 3rd time in the last 10 days - and offers to 'leave things as they are'! At 0.13Mb ............... I think not. 

11 REPLIES
Superuser
Superuser
Posts: 11,076
Thanks: 2,425
Fixes: 22
Registered: 22-08-2007

Re: ADSL very slow - Plusnet response matching it.

Hi,

That sounds grim - 7km is unbelievably long. To be honest you are lucky to get any ADSL service at all. Certainly whilst there is ANY noise on the line broadband is going to struggle.

Are the speeds you've quoted synch speeds or data speed test reports.

Can you please post your router stats - they will indicate if there is anything to reset.
Mikeyorks
Hooked
Posts: 6
Fixes: 1
Registered: 11-08-2017

Re: ADSL very slow - Plusnet response matching it.

Thanks for your reply - much appreciated.

Speed is from the PlusNet badged speed checker (My Broadband speed). Current line speed shown on my account is 0.2Mb.

Apologies if this in any way shows as 'Fixed'. It certainly isn't. But that message came up as I was attempting to hit the Thanks button. This is now so slow that page refreshes are frequent and some data gets misaligned - online Banking is fraught at 0.13Mb !!

 

Hope this is what you wanted. I edited out the personalised username

 

 

 

 

1 - Product name:

Plusnet Router

2 - Serial number:

N7150261B007676 

3 - Firmware version:

7.273.1_F2704N_Plusnet

4 - Board version:

F@ST2704N

5 - Mode

ADSL

6 - Uptime:

1 days 16:16:36

7 - Data rate:

416/192

8 - Maximum data rate:

572/196

9 - Noise margin:

8.0/11.6

10 - Line attenuation:

31.5/63.5

12 - Data sent/received:

35.5M/368.1M

20 - Broadband username:

 

21 - Wi-Fi network/SSID:

PLUSNET-HNGMNN

22 - Wi-Fi connections:

Enable(802.11 b/g/n(up to 144 Mb/s))20 MHz WPS enabled

23 - Wi-Fi security:

WPA2

24 - Wi-Fi channel:

Automatic (Smart Wireless)

25 - Firewall:

Default

26 - MAC Address:

44:e9:dd:a5:23:f3

27 - Software variant

Version 1.0

28 - Boot loader:

7.273.1

Superuser
Superuser
Posts: 11,076
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Registered: 22-08-2007

Re: ADSL very slow - Plusnet response matching it.

Hi,

Yes this is exactly what I wanted.  The line is being managed for stability which will slow it down.  The Download is slower that the upload.  This problem needs taking back to first principles.

To remove the fixed status, click the POST OPTIONs on the one you clicked fixed on and select "remove fix" (or similar words).

You said the phone line was noisy...

Broadband is not going to work well if the "phone" line is not working properly.

Please perform a quiet line test - dial 17070 select option 2 using a corded phone plugged into the test socket behind the face plate of the master socket. It should be silent. A noisy phone line (or no dial tone) will have a marked adverse impact on the performance of broadband.

If the line is noisy or there is no dial tone, then a PHONE LINE fault needs to be raised with your phone provider. If this is PlusNet, you can report a fault on line using the button below.


 

What are the expectations for your line?

Please use the following links to check the services available and their estimated speeds. From the first link, please record and report back the distance from the exchange. The second link advises of which fibre services (if any) are available on your line and their anticipated speed.


 

@CRT,

Can you please provide a VR plot?  What's the CLT error profile please?  What's the line balance looking like?

Accepting the reported history on this line, is there anything further which can be done with BTOR to deliver some improvement ... as the line appears to be performing below what might be expected of a 63.5dB attenuated line ... or is that a 'ceiling' figure reported by this router model?

Moderator
Moderator
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Re: ADSL very slow - Plusnet response matching it.


Mikeyorks wrote:

Apologies if this in any way shows as 'Fixed'. It certainly isn't. But that message came up as I was attempting to hit the Thanks button. 

Moderator's note:

I haver emoved the Fix.

Forum Moderator and Customer
Courage is resistance to fear, mastery of fear, not absence of fear - Mark Twain
He who feared he would not succeed sat still

Plusnet Help Team
Plusnet Help Team
Posts: 6,278
Thanks: 1,706
Fixes: 323
Registered: 21-04-2017

Re: ADSL very slow - Plusnet response matching it.

Sorry to hear you're having speed problems.

 


Mikeyorks wrote:

1. How do I get some meaningful action from PlusNet. We've been here many times, in the first year, and a reset has always worked in the end analysis. But it does appear to be down to the expertise of whoever does it - drawing on my remembrance of several failures in the past.

From testing your line I'm not entirely convinced a SNR reset will fix this. Having said that, I've put that through now. Can you reboot your router in 4 hours and let us know how things look in 24 hours?

I've also raised a broadband fault to our suppliers. I'll reply to your ticket shortly.

 


Mikeyorks wrote:

2. How do I convince PlusNet that I do understand the local infrastructure is the bête noire. But if they wish to use that as the excuse for poor speed and other inconsistencies .............. then that should equally be the default when there is an issue. And not 'please plug into the test socket for 3 days' etc etc etc. Perhaps I'm feeling a bit sensitive at the attempted blackmail of 'an engineer will cost you £55 if no fault found' being uttered for the 3rd time in the last 10 days - and offers to 'leave things as they are'! At 0.13Mb ............... I think not. 


It's just standard process that we need to follow to make you aware of a possible engineer charge, £65 of which is passed on to you should there basically be no fault with the wholesale network.

The checks we ask you to complete reduce the likelihood of an engineer visit becoming chargeable by our suppliers.

 

Can you please provide a VR plot?  What's the CLT error profile please?  What's the line balance looking like?

 
  Upstream DSL Link Information Downstream DSL Link Information
Loop Loss: 39 63.5
SNR Margin: 9 12
Errored Seconds: 0 1
HEC Errors: 0 0
Cell Count: 3509282 22074481
Speed: 416 192

 

Copper Test Details
  A to E B to E
Capacitance: 483 NanoFarad 475 NanoFarad
DP Line Length Estimate: 7185 Metres DN Line Length Estimate: 7185 Metres
Fault Report Advised: N
Service Level: 2

 

Apologies for the inconvenience caused.

 

Anoush

If this post resolved your issue please click the 'This fixed my problem' button
 Anoush Mortazavi
 Plusnet Help Team
Mikeyorks
Hooked
Posts: 6
Fixes: 1
Registered: 11-08-2017

Re: ADSL very slow - Plusnet response matching it.

Townman

 

Many thanks. Yes - the line was noisy and that was the catalyst for the slow broadband speed. But the line was apparently fixed by a BT engineer in very early August. It doesn't figure in the Question I initiated on my PlusNet account - but the line has been fine for close on 2 weeks now. Which makes the continuing speed issue and lack of activity on resolving it - the more irritating. 

 

I see Gandalf has kindly provided most of the data you requested. On the 'line expectations'. The distance is just over 7Km and the cabinet I'm attached to is fibre enabled ........... but is 'not available out here' nor likely to be in the foreseeable future. I was fortunate enough, over a year ago, to get an 'out of area' Openreach expert who'd been called in to help out with local difficulties. He sorted out a wet connection in minutes and clarified this line will support 0.95Mb. But that it has to be set in 0.25Mb increments and therefore 0.75Mb was the practical highest download speed (which I was getting the first 6 months here). He couldn't do a reset without mobile access (no signal here - and need >1Mb broadband to improve it!) - but had it at 0.75Mb within minutes of leaving. But he advised that the only practical improvement I was likely to see was from the rollout of Gfast - or similar.

 

Really appreciate the help.

Mikeyorks
Hooked
Posts: 6
Fixes: 1
Registered: 11-08-2017

Re: ADSL very slow - Plusnet response matching it.

Gandalf

 

Many thanks for the response. I haven't rebooted the router yet but there is a very discernible speed increase that tests out as 0.33Mb.

And whilst that still looks meagre ........... it's 3 times faster than I was getting and is really noticeable.

I'll reboot the router later on and get back to you during tomorrow on, hopefully, an even better performance.

Your comments noted - thanks. I'll have to demur on the 'standard process to avoid an engineer charge' .......... as it's a bit monolithic, with several days between stages. And very much appears - at least in perception if not in reality - that its a process more designed to throughput rates than real problem solving. I've been very pleased with PlusNet over the 7 years or so I've been with them. But I'm reminding myself that most of that time has been problem free - and it's easy to look good when everything is headed in the right direction.

None of that detracts from - "thank you". 

Superuser
Superuser
Posts: 11,076
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Registered: 22-08-2007

Re: ADSL very slow - Plusnet response matching it.

@Gandalf,

Thank you for all of the info - very useful.  I note that there are not many disconnections which is good.  You suggest that a reset is not likely to fix this ... what is there that you are seeing which I'm missing or not privy to?

What's driving the DS 12dB SNRM?  Is that the target or is it the consequence of the package or line banding?

I take it that this is a 20CN only exchange?

Mikeyorks
Hooked
Posts: 6
Fixes: 1
Registered: 11-08-2017

Re: ADSL very slow - Plusnet response matching it.

Fix

At the '24 hour' stage - it's now testing out at 0.35Mb.

Not exactly Utopia - but its about as good as it gets around here. And I can operate with everything I need to at that speed. I won't be downloading films - but I can now safely buy things online / do Banking etc without the fear of payment processes dying on me and creating issues. So I think I'll sign this off as 'fixed' ......... with very real thanks for (both) your help.

I posted this on the open question on my PlusNet account 11 days ago :

 



I can also confirm the internet speed is still at 0.23Mb ............ and that, if the line fault you identified 27th July is now fixed ............. then it will remain at that low level unless and until you reset the speed.

We have been here before, several times, and engineers have - also several times - given the internal wiring etc a clean bill of health. So it appears to me that the default should be to suspect external, rather than internal, sources when this happens. You have previously discussed with me that the unresolvable issue is the 7km of old and patched line between me and the Silloth cabinet and that this creates a variability you cannot control.

So I would suggest there is already enough history that your attitude should be that you suspect those factors first? Question 131303938 (10th Aug 2016) is relevant? In which case - if you have signed off the line as healthy - then can you please reset the line speed in order I can get back to what passes as a service in this area. Otherwise we will go round in circles yet again. And I doubt it is any more beneficial to you than it is to me to simply bat these problems around the same processes when history suggests a shorter fix? I'm more than happy to accommodate yet another engineer - but it isn't necessary if the line fault you identified is now cleared.


If PlusNet had done - what has now been done - I'd be a more content customer.

 

Grateful though - thanks.

Superuser
Superuser
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Registered: 22-08-2007

Re: ADSL very slow - Plusnet response matching it.

Glad to hear that you have made progress.

As for jumping straight to suspect what we all might believe is the issue each time there is a new incident, the diagnosis method is a process which is designed to eliminate issues within the user's control before engaging an engineer who might not be capable of finding the fault and then goes sticking a no-fault-found charge on to Plusnet, of which only a fraction is passed onto the user.

Plusnet Help Team
Plusnet Help Team
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Re: ADSL very slow - Plusnet response matching it.

No problems at all, happy to hear the reset fixed it for you.


Anoush

If this post resolved your issue please click the 'This fixed my problem' button
 Anoush Mortazavi
 Plusnet Help Team