interleaving

[#1]

Ping sorted oldest boy in all his wisdom had gone out and left his pc on downloading hence the high pings turned that off ping are 20 again
See how this connection pans out
Thanks for your help guys
Why did it change from ADSL2 ?

[#2]

In this case, the switch from ADSL2+ to ADSL2 was automatic. Without interleaving and with a target SNRM of 6, your modem determined that none of the frequencies in the higher ADSL2+ range were usable at the time it connected, and an automatic switch to ADSL2 happened.
The only way rebooting the modem would change it back to ADSL2+ would be if you rebooted it at a time when line conditions were better (less noise/interference around), such that a few frequencies in the ADSL2+ range were usable at that time. That wasn't a suggestion to try doing that.

[#3]

^^ Wot he said 
This may be due to some sort of noise (which might be audible, but not necessarily). As already intonated, something seems to be going on.
My "concern" at present is that with that error rate, DLM might up the Target SNRM again, and because the line had had a reset instead of just an Interleaving order, it won't necessarily be possible to do much during the 10 day training period.
I think what I'd suggest, so that you don't get too many errors overnight, is when you've finished using it tonight, do a graceful disconnect and power it off for the night..
Before you switch back on tomorrow, do the ring-back test a few times. Then, at least an hour after sunrise, power up again.
Hopefully this will deal with the mode/speed issue. Post the stats as soon as you are able after power up - don't forget the Uptime with stats

[#4]

Just seen this already at work ill do it when I get home

[#5]

You better post some stats first before switching off so we can see what is going on. I'd do a graceful disconnect as soon as you can and try and leave it off for a lot longer than 10 minutes if possible, but not so that you get closer than an hour before sunset.

[#6]

ok before stats
Link Information
Uptime: 0 days, 18:57:01
DSL Type: ITU-T G.992.3
Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]: 1,039 / 4,687
Data Transferred (Sent/Received) [GB/GB]: 3.85 / 52.81
Output Power (Up/Down) [dBm]: 12.8 / 0.0
Line Attenuation (Up/Down) [dB]: 27.3 / 47.5
SN Margin (Up/Down) [dB]: 6.1 / 5.9
System Vendor ID (Local/Remote): TMMB / ----
Chipset Vendor ID (Local/Remote): BDCM / IFTN
Loss of Framing (Local/Remote): 17 / 0
Loss of Signal (Local/Remote): 2 / 0
Loss of Power (Local/Remote): 0 / 0
Loss of Link (Remote): -
Error Seconds (Local/Remote): 122,081 / 0
FEC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 0
CRC Errors (Up/Down): 77 / 122,094
HEC Errors (Up/Down): 53 / 21,213

And after Stats

Uptime: 0 days, 0:01:14
DSL Type: ITU-T G.992.5
Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]: 1,051 / 4,655
Data Transferred (Sent/Received) [kB/kB]: 95.99 / 156.56
Output Power (Up/Down) [dBm]: 12.8 / 0.0
Line Attenuation (Up/Down) [dB]: 27.3 / 50.5
SN Margin (Up/Down) [dB]: 5.8 / 6.0
System Vendor ID (Local/Remote): TMMB / ----
Chipset Vendor ID (Local/Remote): BDCM / IFTN
Loss of Framing (Local/Remote): 0 / 0
Loss of Signal (Local/Remote): 0 / 0
Loss of Power (Local/Remote): 0 / 0
Loss of Link (Remote): -
Error Seconds (Local/Remote): 39 / 0
FEC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 0
CRC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 232
HEC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 46
Hope this helps
Before the reboot the boys have said the internet has been fine and pings have been good

[#7]

Quote from: scottymc

Didn't see that mate but you are right is that why the Line Attenuation has changed to 47.5 ?

AO and ejs did not explicitly answer this one.  The different modulation standards (ADSL / ADSL2 / ADSL2+) measure attenuation slightly differently.  Due to this, ADSL2+ attenuation figures are always higher than those seen under ADSL(1) on the SAME line.

Quote from: Anotherone

Can you also post the version of Firmware on your TG582n - you'll find it in the Technicolor Gateway box (at the top) - Software Release.

Did you find an answer to this question?  I might have missed it...
One thing which I do not think has been clearly advised is that switching off interleaving removes the ability of the router to perform FEC data recovery, thereby increasing the level of other errors reported (HEC & CRC).  Those data errors require end to end retransmission to recover the data.  That coupled with the reduced synch speed (consequential to moving the SNRM to 6dB) will result in a reduced effective data speed.
Interleaving  / FEC process and data retransmission to achieve lost data recovery can be a delicate balance - something which is often forgotton when the focus is solely on gaming ping times.

[#8]

Quote from: Townman

AO and ejs did not explicitly answer this one.

Sometimes bloated explanations aren't as important as trying to discover what's going on and minimise the risk of DLM making things worse in the short term but particularly as the line has had a reset.

Quote from: Townman

Quote from: Anotherone Can you also post the version of Firmware on your TG582n - you'll find it in the Technicolor Gateway box (at the top) - Software Release. Did you find an answer to this question?  I might have missed it...

No you didn't miss it, and the answer could still be important.
As for FECs, if you'd read the thread more thoroughly, you may have appreciated that it was all mentioned and about the level of CRCs increasing with Interleaving off (they are high anyway) but the ping times are more important than the speed (within reason). As you aren't a Gamer, I can only assume from your sarcastic comment about ping time in another thread, despite it being mentioned, that you just do not appreciate the significance and importance of this for gamers.
@scott
Please remember the Firmware version.
If you can post the current stats when you can, we can see how things are going. Not too happy that the graceful restart didn't produce an improvement in the sync speed (despite the mode going back to ADSL2+).  I think we need to do some more detailed monitoring. It will mean leaving the computer on to do that, but appreciate you may want to turn it off when no-one can keep an eye on the computer.
We'll start with a program called RouterStatsLite (RSL for short) if you can download it, zipped or self-installer, but if the latter, change the install directory to C:/RouterStats-Lite - don't install in Program Files to avoid any potential permission conflicts.
I'll post the suggested setup in my next post.

[#9]

As mentioned, using a program called RouterStatsLite (RSL for short) if you download it, zipped or self-installer, but if the latter, change the install directory to C:/RouterStats-Lite - don't install in Program Files to avoid any potential permission/privilege conflicts.
You can create another folder somewhere if you want to save the Captures and Log file in a different folder from the program (that would be/is my choice), perhaps in your Shared Documents, maybe call it RSLdata.
Below is my suggested setup -
Do not click on the Start Arrow, bottom left, yet! But it ought to automatically open at the Setup tab the first time anyway. Maximise the RouterStats Window.
First go to the Setup tab, then the Router tab and select the modem/router, if it's the 582n then Thomson TG582n / TG587n.
The URL tab should show the path where you get the stats, tick the box for the full path if applicable.
On the Login tab, there should be a tick in the box 'Router requires you to login'for most modem/routers.
The Username will show the default one, which you may have changed (admin for the 582n).
The password may be a default one (unless changed by you) or the one provided with the router originally - note, this is not your broadband password (it begins CP...... for the 582n).
On the Graph tab, initially, untick the Adjust axis automatically boxes, you may want to alter the settings later. For the Noise Margin, set the Maximum to 10 and the Minimum to 0. For the Connection Speed set the maximum to 6000, minimum to 0. Tick Noise Margin Vertical Axis 'Plot average value of previous 50 points', but not the Connection Speed average. Remember to click Apply on both boxes (and any other time  you make changes).
In the Sample Interval box choose 'Sample router every 10 seconds' and 'Points per page 720' and click Apply.
Next, go to the Capture tab. Define the folder where you want to save the Captured graphs, this could be the folder where you've installed RSL or better another of your choice. Tick 'Capture noise margin graph images', also tick 'Capture part-graphs when RouterStats-Lite closes'. Tick the other two graphs if you wish.  (The Ping capture setting is not saved on RSL close note).
Go to the Log tab, type the filename you want for the log, e.g. RSLite.txt & then browse to the folder you want to save it in, suggest the same as the graphs, when selected, the full pathname will appear in the box. Comma separated values is selected by default, and log every 1 sample.
Nothing to change on the Appearance tab.
On the System tab, tick 'Minimise to system tray', 'Prompt before closing', 'Show noise margin on tray icon' & 'Show tooltip hints'. If you want the Ping plotter, tick that as well. On the PIng tab you need to specify the IP address to ping - try 212.159.13.49 - one of Plusnet's ntp servers.
You can now go to the Noise Margin tab and click on the green Start button. You should see a Green Camera icon on the LHS showing capture is active.
If you right click on the graph, the drop down menu shows a tick against Capture. You will also see some other handy options you can use at any time, similar on the other graphs, but on this one Tick 'Plot Upstream Noise'.
There is a minor bug in the last few versions where the ping is not always Captured automatically, so if you want one, do a right click Capture now.
Nor is the capture setting saved on RSL close.
Maximise the RouterStats window before Minimising it to the Tray. This ensures captures are at the full screen size showing the most detail (as far as the SNRM is concerned).

[#10]

Product Name:      TG582n
Software Release:      10.2.2.B
In Greece sail I did post this before 

[#11]

Oops, that'll teach me to double check more carefully, yes you did     So that's two of us that need a trip to specsavers  
Will await your further posts in due course, whenever that is
Edit: spelling

[#12]

Blame my varifocals! 

[#13]

Ok guys back from sailing in Greece . Here are my stats
Link Information
Uptime: 8 days, 12:28:15
DSL Type: ITU-T G.992.5
Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]: 1,019 / 4,544
Data Transferred (Sent/Received) [GB/GB]: 5.33 / 68.72
Output Power (Up/Down) [dBm]: 12.8 / 0.0
Line Attenuation (Up/Down) [dB]: 27.3 / 51.0
SN Margin (Up/Down) [dB]: 6.1 / 6.8
System Vendor ID (Local/Remote): TMMB / ----
Chipset Vendor ID (Local/Remote): BDCM / IFTN
Loss of Framing (Local/Remote): 8 / 0
Loss of Signal (Local/Remote): 1 / 0
Loss of Power (Local/Remote): 0 / 0
Loss of Link (Remote): -
Error Seconds (Local/Remote): 237,328 / 0
FEC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 0
CRC Errors (Up/Down): 2,505 / 335,354
HEC Errors (Up/Down): 2,075 / 88,279

Think i could probably do a reboot i might get a better sync speed but other than that the kids have said the connection as been fine so fingers crossed
what do you guys think of the stats

[#14]

Far too many Error Seconds in those stats. I calculated the MTBE to be around 3 which is far too low and very likely to cause the DLM to do something about that (increase the noise margin, which will decrease the speed further). 1 error approx. every 3 seconds, that's one packet lost every 3 seconds.
The line rate of 4544k is the top end of one of the banded profiles. We can't really tell if the DLM has set the banded profile and the speed will be limited to 4544k, or if it was just coincidence that the speed happened to be 4544k the last time it re-connected.

[#15]

Whilst ejs may be right about banding,  this could have been DLM dropping sync about 0500 on the 17th then doing a resync won't achieve anything.  If your boys are finding things OK for gaming,  then I think getting RSL running would be good to see if we can get a handle on what's happening on the line.
Things do seem to be getting a touch worse,  and with that in mind,  do you have another modem/router and filter handy as we may have to try that at some point, but not yet, RSL first.