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how can I protect my DSL from storms

David_W
Rising Star
Posts: 2,301
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Registered: ‎19-07-2007

Re: how can I protect my DSL from storms

You could buy a surge protector with built in phone socket.  I have a Belkin Surgemaster which would let me plug a phone socket into the surge protector so if the phone line was struck by lightening the protector should in theory prevent my router blowing up.  If the router (or any device attached to the protector) did blow up due to the strike, Belkin guarantee against damaged for up to £10,000.
Of course, the protector has a standard UK plug socket and I have no idea what it would do with SNR/attenuation so I don't actually use it with my phone socket, just for my PC.  I'd probably have to stick a filter into the protector and then another filter between the protector and the phone socket, not even sure if it would work for the internet either so umm, yeah, it's possible to surge protect the phone line.  Then of course we get the question of if the phone line was struck would it travel down the phone cable to the router and then through the router via all the ethernet cables to connected devices, or would the surge protector kill the router first..... I have no idea.
itsme
Grafter
Posts: 5,924
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Registered: ‎07-04-2007

Re: how can I protect my DSL from storms

Nope. I have a Belkin mains distribution panel with telephone surge protection and there was an electrical storm near by, not sure how far but I was not aware of any lightening strikes close to my house. It took out the telephone surge protector, 2 ADSL filters, ADSL modem, VoIP ATA and an ethernet card. The ethernet card was connected to the VoIP ATA .
Community Veteran
Posts: 3,191
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Registered: ‎31-07-2007

Re: how can I protect my DSL from storms

I get lighting fairly often here, all I can say is unplug all connections to your pc and router if you can.  Do not rely on surge protection, as all it takes one hit and it no longer works then so does your pc on next hit.
In the last 5 years I've Lost 1 complete pc and 2 routers[left the phone socket jack in] and a second PC is now a backup as its been roasted but not dead so works if badly.
Unvalued customer since 2001 funding cheap internet for others / DSL/Fibre house move 24 month regrade from 8th May 2017
pierre_pierre
Grafter
Posts: 19,757
Registered: ‎30-07-2007

Re: how can I protect my DSL from storms

just found the instruction sheet for my surge socket strip (was looking for something else)
it clearly says in a highlighted part
"This device is not a lightening arrester and will not protect equipment against lightening strikes"
Community Veteran
Posts: 6,098
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Registered: ‎23-09-2010

Re: how can I protect my DSL from storms

When is  a surge not a surge?
That's like when they say something is waterproof when they really mean it's splash proof.
magnetism2772
Grafter
Posts: 983
Registered: ‎06-06-2010

Re: how can I protect my DSL from storms

yes its all  about  getting the right surge protection
I believe church steeples have some kind of  lightening protection.
I'll have to look into how that is done
then couple my modem cable to it  by transformer action  (only kidding)
I'm disconnecting the pc , my internet and my tv antenna from the pc
in future storms
VileReynard
Aspiring Champion
Posts: 11,683
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Registered: ‎01-09-2007

Re: how can I protect my DSL from storms

You have to have a proper perspective on these things.
The phone cable that runs from my telegraph pole is considerably higher than my router, yet the steel wire supporting the cable does not appear to be earthed at either end.
Perhaps the GPO assumed that the rain usually found in the presence of lightening would complete the circuit?
Lightening in the home is a rare event.

"In The Beginning Was The Word, And The Word Was Aardvark."

pierre_pierre
Grafter
Posts: 19,757
Registered: ‎30-07-2007

Re: how can I protect my DSL from storms

dont tell the rogues, but is a thick copper bar from top to bottom, usually with a multi pronged bit at the top,
my picture of our local church (When I was trying out the Zoom) is not clear enough to show it, but google lightning conductors there a lot of examples (UK)
how is your PC connected to the router?  not a hope in A Fox of lightning travelling over your WiFi link
Agreed take out the Antenna lead from TV
Funny Story
I Used to do a Sat Job for Curry's before they sold out to DSG.  Got called out to a Local Judge, his TV had stopped working, simple repair plug in the Antenna (His wife had taken it out during a storm)
feroluce
Grafter
Posts: 26
Registered: ‎20-08-2010

Re: how can I protect my DSL from storms

There's a very obvious point that everybody overlooks.
I did for years until it was pointed out to me, then it seemed obvious.
If the electricity can make it from the sky to your house, it can certainly make it across the poles of a switch!
So why doesn't it?
The thing is, it doesn't really work that way.
Lightning happens when a 'circuit' is made between the earth and the charged cloud.
The trick is to prevent the lightning from 'seeing' earth.
Telephone systems usually don't carry enough, if any, earth connection, for the lightning to see it.
Actual Earth is far more inviting and only a couple of metres below the phone wire.
That changes if a current happens to be running through the phone line when the lightning comes calling.
Static electricity (which is what lightning is) finds 'real' electricity irresistible. You can actually shape static discharge with an electric field.
Surge protectors work by hiding earth from the lightning.
It looks like a dead end, so the electricity ignores the route.
A lightning strike in your area will interfere with your WiFi, but only in the way it interferes with your telly or radio.
It sends out a quick burst in every frequency, this effectively jams every signal for a fraction of a second.
Your network can easily deal with it and you shouldn't really notice.
I refuse to get technical here. If I do it will really melt your brain.
If I told you lightning actually goes up, or explained that main purpose of a lightning conductor isn't to conduct lightning, but to 'push' lightning clouds away, you'd think I was mad. So I won't.
Twelve years dealing with noise propagation and transmission means I have a plethora of completely useless information about lightning.
itsme
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Registered: ‎07-04-2007

Re: how can I protect my DSL from storms

Quote from: feroluce
Telephone systems usually don't carry enough, if any, earth connection, for the lightning to see it.
Actual Earth is far more inviting and only a couple of metres below the phone wire.

Telegraph poles have an earth conductor running from the junction box at the top of the pole to the ground. Have a look the next time you pass one.
Quote from: feroluce
Surge protectors work by hiding earth from the lightning.
It looks like a dead end, so the electricity ignores the route.

That a new one on me. Does not a surge protector break down at a certain voltage and the energy is diverted to ground?
Quote from: feroluce
I refuse to get technical here. If I do it will really melt your brain.
If I told you lightning actually goes up, or explained that main purpose of a lightning conductor isn't to conduct lightning, but to 'push' lightning clouds away, you'd think I was mad. So I won't.
Twelve years dealing with noise propagation and transmission means I have a plethora of completely useless information about lightning.

Thought it was to discharge the cloud to ground.
magnetism2772
Grafter
Posts: 983
Registered: ‎06-06-2010

Re: how can I protect my DSL from storms

Thought it was to discharge the cloud to ground.
it all depends on how you view electric (electron)current flow
conventional current flow suggests current flows from a positive charge
to a negative charge or + to - this was decided in the late 1700's by benjamin franklin
legend (conjecture back then) as it but turned out to be wrong as far as the flow of electrons was concerned
Versus Electron flow
Franklin assumed electric charge moved in the opposite direction that it actually does, and so objects he called "negative" (representing a deficiency of charge) actually have a surplus of electrons.
so today we have changed the nomenclature correctly to - to  +
but we can see current flow  two ways
its really like this
Black can be seen as the lack of white
or White can be seen as the lack of black
so given that current flows -to +
and by  convention(old tradition)
current flow used to seen as  flowing + to -
things are like this

drawing 1
A lightning strike consists of opposite charges of electrical energy. A negative charge or build-up occurs in the bottom part of the cloud closest to earth and a positive charge of energy occurs directly underneath in the ground. Separating these two opposite charges is the non-conducting dry air belt separating cloud and earth. As the two opposite charges continue to build up and the dry air belt becomes moist, lightning starts down toward earth in 150 foot jagged steps or intervals. The positive ground charge is attracted upward, utilizing the lightning protection system on the building as an outlet.
drawing 2
As the negative leader stroke from the cloud continues toward earth, the positive ground charge travels up through the Lightning Rod System and when the negative leader stroke is about 150 feet above the top of the protected building, the positive ground charge starts upward to meet and neutralize the downward leader stroke.

In drawing 3, the two opposite charges are neutralized emptying the negative charges from the cloud and dissipating the ground charge. This all occurs in about one five thousandths of a second.

In drawing end 4, the discharge has been completed and the negative cloud charge and the positive ground charge becomes zero.
pierre_pierre
Grafter
Posts: 19,757
Registered: ‎30-07-2007

Re: how can I protect my DSL from storms

here with photo of the lightning conductor on my local church, it the green thing going up the spire
magnetism2772
Grafter
Posts: 983
Registered: ‎06-06-2010

Re: how can I protect my DSL from storms

oh yes, i've just enlarged the photo
great
and
complementarity to what i've said
xcellent
VileReynard
Aspiring Champion
Posts: 11,683
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Registered: ‎01-09-2007

Re: how can I protect my DSL from storms

Quote from: itsme
Telegraph poles have an earth conductor running from the junction box at the top of the pole to the ground. Have a look the next time you pass one.

Mine doesn't - it's just a bit of tough plastic to protect the wires where they emerge from the underground channel.
Anti-vandal, I suppose.

"In The Beginning Was The Word, And The Word Was Aardvark."

pierre_pierre
Grafter
Posts: 19,757
Registered: ‎30-07-2007

Re: how can I protect my DSL from storms

just looked at the one by my front garden, definitely no separate earth wire, just one thick cable