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Turning my router off

Razer
Grafter
Posts: 1,398
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Registered: ‎17-11-2012

Re: Turning my router off

No, there's no orange bell wire connected, already checked that. In fact, there's no wires connected to the removable faceplate at all, and inside the box itself it (which I have had off to look at) looks a bit old to me. I'll get a pic to show you. I do have some intermittent crackling on my line - which miraculously disappears as soon as I do a quiet line test (just got my first ever engaged tone on 17070, incidentally - made me laugh).
Anotherone
Champion
Posts: 19,107
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Registered: ‎31-08-2007

Re: Turning my router off

So, to be clear, is this "extension" a hard wired job, or a plug-in one?
Well I assume you know to report the crackly line as a phone fault if/when you can catch it for long enough (and don't mention the broadband) but we'll await a pic before saying any more.
Razer
Grafter
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Registered: ‎17-11-2012

Re: Turning my router off

It's a plug in telephone extension. A flat one (yeah, I know). This is why I was opening the box. I wanted to see what the setup was because I was thinking of fitting an ADSL faceplate to my NTE5 box (I'd prefer to use my ADSL extension), but I didn't find quite what I expected (faceplate not wired and in the box six wires instead of four).
As for the crackly line, I was waiting for the broadband to be connected for a while before getting into those murky waters because I was sure I'd get the spiel about the line having to settle down first. Anyway, here's what's in my box. Does that seem right to you, connections inside the box but none attached to the faceplate and six wires?
jelv
Seasoned Hero
Posts: 26,785
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Registered: ‎10-04-2007

Re: Turning my router off

Could you use a standard socket to router cable and then use a long Ethernet cable? That way round is way better.
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
Broadband: Andrews & Arnold Home::1 (FTTC 80/20)
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Razer
Grafter
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Registered: ‎17-11-2012

Re: Turning my router off

I thought of doing that, but I don't currently have one long enough for continual use. That said, my tests in the master socket and test socket noted above involved a longer socket to router cable, but that was having it sprawled across the floor (along with the router); no good for constant use (and seemed to make little difference to the connection).
jelv
Seasoned Hero
Posts: 26,785
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Registered: ‎10-04-2007

Re: Turning my router off

There appeared to be a difference in the attenuation which suggests that extension isn't the best!
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
Broadband: Andrews & Arnold Home::1 (FTTC 80/20)
Line rental: Pulse 8 Home Line Rental (£14.40/month)
Mobile: iD mobile (£4/month)
Razer
Grafter
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Registered: ‎17-11-2012

Re: Turning my router off

No, I don't like being on extension at all anyway, but need some form of extension/longer cables to be connected at all. I've been trying to decide which way to do it; ADSL extension with adding an ADSL faceplate to my master socket (which didn't end up looking as I expected and so doesn't follow advice I've seen online for adding one and made me pause), or the longer socket to router cable you suggest. Either way I need about 8-10 meters extension.
jelv
Seasoned Hero
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Registered: ‎10-04-2007

Re: Turning my router off

Another option is powerline adapters which means no trailing cable and you could move the PC to anywhere in the house.
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
Broadband: Andrews & Arnold Home::1 (FTTC 80/20)
Line rental: Pulse 8 Home Line Rental (£14.40/month)
Mobile: iD mobile (£4/month)
Razer
Grafter
Posts: 1,398
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Registered: ‎17-11-2012

Re: Turning my router off

I was just looking over the attenuation numbers again; I see what you mean.
Quote from: jelv
Another option is powerline adapters which means no trailing cable and you could move the PC to anywhere in the house.

What's that? I imagine it's something to do with utilising the power socket lines (surely it can't be, given the interference that apparently can happen to BB from power cables).
Edited to add, I just looked into these powerline adapters. I'm surprised that they are what I imagined. I absolutely love the idea of it. Alas, can't do it. I run my computer and all its attachments through an 8 gang surge protector, so no spare direct socket and I can't move my computer. Thanks for the suggestion though. Wish I could use it, I love it so much. Reminds me of how office intercoms worked years ago (don't know if they still do).
vultura
Rising Star
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Registered: ‎22-05-2011

Re: Turning my router off

Razer, powerlines can work on a normal extension gang (not surge one though, as I understand it), might not give full performance, but should be ok.
Like you I have little choice in where I can plug them (most rooms only having one or two sockets) and have been running 200Mbps ones on extension cables for some time.
Has anyone seen my signature, it's gone missing.
Razer
Grafter
Posts: 1,398
Thanks: 8
Registered: ‎17-11-2012

Re: Turning my router off

Their possibly not giving full performance was something I had thought of and it would be defeating the object even if I could use them. It's extension with lower performance versus powerlines with lower performance, though the removal of some length of cabling is still appealing to me. As for sockets, it's not for want of sockets, I have six in one room! It's just that I can only put my computer in one place (with the 8 gang surge protector). Drives me nuts when room dimensions, window placement, radiator location, sockets and furniture dictate so much where you can put things, and further dictates what extensions and cabling you have to use. So much for six sockets - to use the other four I'd have to use extensions! Now, where is that wall that's so useful to smash my head against? ... brb after the hospital.
jelv
Seasoned Hero
Posts: 26,785
Thanks: 971
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Registered: ‎10-04-2007

Re: Turning my router off

Difficult choice: the powerlines might degrade from 10 times as fast as your ADSL connection to only 5 times as fast - will that actually matter?
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
Broadband: Andrews & Arnold Home::1 (FTTC 80/20)
Line rental: Pulse 8 Home Line Rental (£14.40/month)
Mobile: iD mobile (£4/month)
Anotherone
Champion
Posts: 19,107
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Registered: ‎31-08-2007

Re: Turning my router off

Let's clear up any misunderstanding about wiring - what you see feeding your NTE5a is exactly what you might expect to see where the drop-wire or underground feed terminates elsewhere in the building, and standard 3 pair CW1308 has been used from that NTP to your NTE5a. Your telephone line only consists of 1 connected pair.
Worth asking though, this is the only telephone socket connected in the property is it?
The "issue with the bell-wire" normally arises with what ever the user has connected OR plugs in, on their side of the NTE5a.
Regular phone type extension leads, such as what it sounds as if you are using contain a bell wire!
As for in your room, there is little point in fitting a filtered faceplate if you are then going to have trailing extension leads all over the place. In any event when testing from a test socket, a filter should plug directly into the test socket and the modem/router direct into the filter with no extension leads otherwise you only recreate exactly what you had before. The only point in removing the faceplate is to isolate any internal hard wired extensions connected to it.
The only point of fitting a filtered faceplate is if you are going to have the modem/router or the phone right next to it, the latter to save a dangly filter and you then have proper hard wired unfiltered extension wiring for the modem/router.
The most obvious and neatest solution is to fit your own hard wired extension, you can use a filtered extension socket if you don't want a dangly filter at the extension, but performance wise, there is very little or no difference and added expense with a filtered socket. Fitting a standard hard wired extension using the correct cable will not give performance issues and is also the cheapest solution. You can then use the original very short modem/router cable (or if you really need a slightly longer one, get a twisted pair screened one),
For the extension you will need to buy some 2 pair CW1308 cable, some 3.5mm cable clips and a Disposable IDC tool from the tools page.
I wouldn't recommend buying the cable anywhere except from a reliable source, there is fake standard CW1308 about. You can get the standard extension socket itself at any DIY shed, local store etc. or even eBay, Amazon etc. A standard 86x86mm socket and mounting box should cost no more than £2-3, any more is a rip-off (watch for postage costs if buying online, some are a rip-off as well!).
When connecting the extension you only use the one pair, Blue+white trace on terminal 2 and White+blue trace on terminal 5.
Razer
Grafter
Posts: 1,398
Thanks: 8
Registered: ‎17-11-2012

Re: Turning my router off

Quote from: jelv
Difficult choice: the powerlines might degrade from 10 times as fast as your ADSL connection to only 5 times as fast - will that actually matter?
If they offered the better solution I would use them without question, indeed especially to cut out external cabling. It's academic for me though as I can't use them.
Quote from: Anotherone
Let's clear up any misunderstanding about wiring - what you see feeding your NTE5a is exactly what you might expect to see where the drop-wire or underground feed terminates elsewhere in the building, and standard 3 pair CW1308 has been used from that NTP to your NTE5a. Your telephone line only consists of 1 connected pair.
Worth asking though, this is the only telephone socket connected in the property is it?

Good morning, and thank you for your continuing attention with this, and thank you for that, too. Good to know all is normal there. Yes, it's the only socket in the property, installed at build ten years ago.
Quote
The "issue with the bell-wire" normally arises with what ever the user has connected OR plugs in, on their side of the NTE5a.
Regular phone type extension leads, such as what it sounds as if you are using contain a bell wire!

Ah, that's useful to know. Thanks for that, too.
Quote
As for in your room, there is little point in fitting a filtered faceplate if you are then going to have trailing extension leads all over the place.

I was wanting to make use of my ADSL extension, which a BT man very kindly put together for me with my previous BE installation elsewhere when he came to replace the property to the cabinet cable. He made it for me after fitting an ADSL faceplate because the socket was in my hallway, well away from my computer. I can only assume it is the correct type of cabling you talk of later: CW1308. It and the box it is attached to looks identical to one featured here: BT engineers ADSL extension kit. Even if I were to choose to hard wire my current ADSL extension by snipping off the plug and fixing the wires inside, I'd still have to buy a faceplate suitable to take it (wire outlet). Unless I cut a hole at the bottom of my current faceplate myself.
Quote
In any event when testing from a test socket, a filter should plug directly into the test socket and the modem/router direct into the filter with no extension leads otherwise you only recreate exactly what you had before.

Yes, I know, and that's how I ran the tests I did directly into the Master and Test sockets; with the filter only.
Either way, thanks for the link and further information. It is much appreciated.
Anotherone
Champion
Posts: 19,107
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Registered: ‎31-08-2007

Re: Turning my router off

Your BT engineers extension kit cabling should be fine whether it's CW1308 - the standard cable use by BT for extension wiring - or even if it is Cat5e standard - a higher standard. It may be thicker than CW1308 if it is Cat5e unless it is a 2-pair (not widely available), the latter being used on vDSL extensions (Fibre).
The standard faceplate should have a small slot in the bottom edge for extension cabling, but where are you plugging the phone in? If at the NTE5a and using a Filtered Plate and there isn't a slot, just file one - but the Filtered plate must have the unfiltered terminals if hard-wiring an ADSL extension. If you are going to plug the phone in at the NTE5a, why not just plug your ADSL extension kit into the filtered plate?