Technical question about speed vs distance from the echange

[#1]

Quote from: Carl

These are the only stats I could find: ADSL Link Downstream Upstream Connection Speed 416 kbps 288 kbps Line Attenuation 13 db 3 db Noise Margin 6 db 7 db

This is broken - very broken! I can't trace your account because it looks like you changed your Forums username but if you haven't got a fault raised yet, please do so and it's likely we'll get an engineer straight out (assuming an alternate router has been / can be tested into the test socket) to fix this. It doesn't look like a distance issue, as a low line attenuation (generally) means low distance but the sync speeds are very poor.

[#2]

Ben beat me to it, those stats show that something is VERY wrong.
I don't like this though

Quote

I have heard other people on the line when I make phone calls. It always sounds like the same woman actually... I can hear her clearly. I've not had crackling on the line though.

Would it be best processed as a voice fault first Ben ?

[#3]

Hi Carl,
I'm not sure where you got them stats from, as you aren't connected with us. I popped your address into the BT Availability Checker and got this...
"Our check also indicates that your line currently supports an estimated ADSL Max broadband line speed of 7.5Mbps; typically the line speed would range between 6.5Mbps and 8Mbps."
Guys...

Quote from: Carl

I'm not currently with PlusNet but have just switched over & am awaiting my connection. I chose PlusNet based on all the good reports I hear about customer services 🙂

I'm sure it'll be fine, Carl.
Jojo

[#4]

Quote from: MisterW

Would it be best processed as a voice fault first Ben ?

Yes, this sounds like a classic crossed line that should be progressed as a PSTN fault. I'd missed that the OP's service wasn't with us yet so I'd say allow all services to transfer over and then get the issue reported and it's likely that resolving the PSTN issue will resolve the ADSL issues too - note the low upstream speed, often caused by PSTN issues.
@Carl
Is the other person able to hear you on the line? If you can get their phone number then it'll help the engineer locate the source of the problem, if one is needed after the transfer.

[#5]

Quote

so I'd say allow all services to transfer over and then get the issue reported

@carl,It's not clear whether you're transferring both Broadband and Phone to PlusNet or just Broadband. If its both then its simplest to do as Ben says. If you're only transferring the BB then you will need to contact your current Phone provider and report the PSTN fault.

[#6]

Quote from: pierre_pierre

are well you are in Wooly Wales below are the stages

Thank you. I managed to get it working with Chrome. Wouldn't work in Firefox for some reason...

[#7]

Quote from: Ben

Quote from: Carl These are the only stats I could find: ADSL Link Downstream Upstream Connection Speed 416 kbps 288 kbps Line Attenuation 13 db 3 db Noise Margin 6 db 7 db This is broken - very broken! I can't trace your account because it looks like you changed your Forums username but if you haven't got a fault raised yet, please do so and it's likely we'll get an engineer straight out (assuming an alternate router has been / can be tested into the test socket) to fix this. It doesn't look like a distance issue, as a low line attenuation (generally) means low distance but the sync speeds are very poor.

Hi Ben, I'm with PlusNet in spirit but not in body yet 😉 I've signed up & have received my router today but connection will probably be next week while I'm away.
Why do you come to the conclusion that it is broken? Is it just because the speed is low or is it something to do with the other figures? I understand the speed is mega bits per second, but the decibel figures mean nothing to me. Are they too high/low? What should they be? Do they vary with line speed? My old ISP seems to think they are normal.
I must say that I'm liking the kind of support I see already with Plusnet. Forums make all the difference because the support guys can't get away with telling customers a pack of fibs just to get them to go away 🙂

[#8]

Quote from: Ben

Quote from: MisterW Would it be best processed as a voice fault first Ben ? @Carl Is the other person able to hear you on the line? If you can get their phone number then it'll help the engineer locate the source of the problem, if one is needed after the transfer.

I have no idea, Ben. I don't use the phone very often so if it is the same person it will be pure chance that we are on the phone at the same time. Two times that I heard the other person on the line I was online to support of my current ISP. They could here her, too, but don't take any action until I have logged five of these incidents with dates, times, number I was calling. It has only happened about three times and I have two of them logged. As this has been going on since March & there seems to be no way they are going to do anything about it, so I've decided to move away from them.
I assume this is something a BT engineer would need to resolve? Once my line is switched over to Plusnet I will use everything you have supplied to connect to make things easier.

[#9]

Quote from: MisterW

Quote so I'd say allow all services to transfer over and then get the issue reported @carl,It's not clear whether you're transferring both Broadband and Phone to PlusNet or just Broadband. If its both then its simplest to do as Ben says. If you're only transferring the BB then you will need to contact your current Phone provider and report the PSTN fault.

I'm transferring both over but believe the phone line moves over a couple of weeks after broadband, is that right? If it means getting things sorted then I am happy to wait a couple more weeks.

[#10]

Quote from: Joanne

Quote from: Carl I'm not currently with PlusNet but have just switched over & am awaiting my connection. I chose PlusNet based on all the good reports I hear about customer services 🙂 I'm sure it'll be fine, Carl. Jojo

My fingers are tightly crossed, thank you 🙂

[#11]

Quote from: Carl

ADSL Link Downstream Upstream Connection Speed 416 kbps 288 kbps Line Attenuation 13 db 3 db Noise Margin 6 db 7 db Why do you come to the conclusion that it is broken?

I guess it's because the line attenuation is very low which, if correct, would indicate you should be getting the 7500 kbps speeds you say your neighbours achieve.

[#12]

Also the Upstream figures are VERY bad. You would expect a line with 3db Upstream attenuation to be synching at 448k with a noise margin in excess of 20db. For the upstream to be at 288k shows a major problem somewhere, probably a crossed line as Ben suggeested.

[#13]

I think I understand that low line attenuation is good and high noise is good, is that right? Assuming an ideal setup without faults that is. I've worked in audio electronics but with audio, less noise was better and we were working with 0.001db, although a few megawatts of Sisters of Mercy in a car could be still be considered noise to some 😉
Thank you for taking the trouble to explain it to me. I am a technical person but haven't needed to understand the technicalities of broadband until now. Before I moved here, it just worked without question!
Carl.

[#14]

Quote

I think I understand that low line attenuation is good and high noise is good, is that right?

Yes, but what's slightly confusing is that its Noise Margin or SNR( signal to noise ratio ) which is normally quoted. So its really the same as your experience in Audio, in that low noise ( or high SNR ) is good!. It's actually a bit more complicated than that in practice since noise increases as speeds get higher and so the SNR drops. The exchange equipment has a target SNR ( usually 6db ) and will synch at the highest speed possible consistent with maintaining that SNR. The Upstream speed is limited to 448k ( unless uncapped ) and so at that speed, on a good line, you would expect a much higher SNR than you are achieving and in fact your Upstream speed has dropped to 288k to maintain the 6db SNR target.

[#15]

Not quite correct
Low attenuation is good because it will allow higher speeds
High noise margin is only good if the speed is being restricted externally  - such as upstream at 448kbps
Low noise margin is good where you are trying to get the best speed. The default noise margin as set at the exchange is normally 6dB which only increases if the automatic systems think that there are problems with the line.
In your case, when the problem is sorted I would expect an upstream noise margin in excess of 20dB and downstream of about 12dB or perhaps more as you will be restricted by the speed limit on ADSL1 (8,128kbps when interleaving is switched off)