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Re: £5 for 5GB - Split for discussion on potential speed advantages of ADSL2+
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Re: £5 for 5GB - Split for discussion on potential speed advantages of ADSL2+
14-03-2010 2:11 AM
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Quote from: wurzel I want to know if I change from Value to Extra will my download of 0.75MB increase ?
The exchange isn't 21CN enabled so the possibility of ADSL2 isn't a factor for the present. My guess is that you probably wouldn't notice any speed difference. If usage patterns are likely to increase, regularly taking you over 10GB the additional data allowance might be cost effective.
However if you wanted to try it, once the new product is launched I imagine the Comms Team would allow you to try it for a month at the published price, then move you back to Value at the frozen price if it was not for you.
David
David
Message 16 of 24
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Re: Re: £5 for 5GB - Split for discussion on potential speed advantages of ADSL2+
14-03-2010 2:18 AM
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Quote from: spraxyt Kitz used quite a lot of user feedback (from all ISPs) to check and refine her figures to reflect real experience in the UK, though probably largely LLU for above 8M.
I just had another look at Kitz's checker.... and in the small print she says it is based upon... Internode's graph!!!
(albeit based on someone else's work from the Aus "Whirlpool Forums" who made a formula or something.)
Se does say she's refined it based on the real world though.
Interestingly the ADSL2+ percentage speed gains are listed as:
Lowest speed listed is 67db which estimates a 25% increase in both headline speed and profile
The OP's 63db is listed at 25% improvement too (albeit the headline figure for that is a faster 1.5Mb/s already, so if real world is half that, then there might be interference issues on that line which might be improved by ADSL2+ or made worse!)
The middle speeds are list with approx a 10% margin right up to 5.5Mb/s on ADSL1, from where on the gains start to accelerate again exponentially!
I remember reading Kitz said she'd be deliberately conservative in her figures too. But she appears to have an even bigger flat spot in the middle with 10% gains. But consistently lists the lowest speeds with 25% increases... which would confirm her use of a chart more like Internode than the BE/O2 one... whether her data is more accurate than Internode or BE/O2 is another question!
Quote from: wurzel I want to know if I change from Value to Extra will my download of 0.75MB increase ?
With that info, I'm afraid it is bad news. Your exchange doesn't have a date for ADSL2+, but also is listed as potentially having some speed problems at peak time due to congestion in the exchange!. Fortunately they listed the fix date as being 5th March, so it might have just been fixed or immanent for it.
So you can't get ADSL2+ because it is not available at your exchange, and your connection is already so slow that traffic profiles won't be slowing much of your traffic any further, so EXTRA probably won't give you any speed benefit.
The repairs at the exchange might help speeds in the evenings though.
Your attenuation figures checked on Kitz's checker, also suggest that your line might in theory support a higher connection speed on ADSL1 than you are currently getting (up to twice as fast), so it would be well worth doing some tests to see if you can get your speeds up even when staying on VALUE and ADSL 1.
That isn't my area of expertise, but if you can post your noise margin, and some speedtest results, then someone else might be able to suggest a few things you can try to improve your current setup.
Mike
Message 17 of 24
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Re: £5 for 5GB - Split for discussion on potential speed advantages of ADSL2+
14-03-2010 2:16 PM
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David and Mike,
Thanks for your helpful comments.
As I am on a BTW Exchange (at an extra cost of £6) Will it always be so ?
Will Plusnet reduce my Package by £6 if they take over my line ?
Thanks for your helpful comments.
As I am on a BTW Exchange (at an extra cost of £6) Will it always be so ?
Will Plusnet reduce my Package by £6 if they take over my line ?
Message 18 of 24
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Re: £5 for 5GB - Split for discussion on potential speed advantages of ADSL2+
14-03-2010 3:17 PM
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Sorry Wurzel,
I don't understand your question... ?
You are currently on VALUE. Paying what £6 extra? To whom? For what?
Mike
I don't understand your question... ?
You are currently on VALUE. Paying what £6 extra? To whom? For what?
Mike
Message 19 of 24
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Re: £5 for 5GB - Split for discussion on potential speed advantages of ADSL2+
14-03-2010 6:41 PM
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Mike,
I pay £11.99 for VALUE on a BTW Exchange,
If I was on a LLU Exchange it would be £5.99
Regards,
Eric
I pay £11.99 for VALUE on a BTW Exchange,
If I was on a LLU Exchange it would be £5.99
Regards,
Eric
Message 20 of 24
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Re: £5 for 5GB - Split for discussion on potential speed advantages of ADSL2+
14-03-2010 9:36 PM
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Broadband pricing has nothing to do with who you pay line rental to. Separate Ofcom regulations control prices for the latter aspect.
For broadband, the prices that BT Wholesale are permitted to charge are regulated by Ofcom in Market 1 and 2 areas to encourage competition. Market 3 exchanges, where no operator is deemed to possess significant market power are unregulated allowing BT Wholesale to charge lower prices and compete with the LLU operators. Exchanges in the latter market (covering 70% of the UK) are known as 'low cost areas'. Plusnet pass on the lower costs in these areas to customers. Unfortunately customers such as yourself in Market 1 and 2 areas do not benefit.
If Ofcom's regulatory policy encourages LLU operators to set up in your exchange in time it should become Market 3 (unregulated) and you would benefit too. So yes, prices could eventually reduce, but it requires competitors to establish a presence in your area, or a change in Ofcom policy.
More on this can be found on
Plusnet's 'Low Cost Areas' page.
Ofcom's Summary page; or the full works
Ofcom's Review of the wholesale broadband access markets
David
For broadband, the prices that BT Wholesale are permitted to charge are regulated by Ofcom in Market 1 and 2 areas to encourage competition. Market 3 exchanges, where no operator is deemed to possess significant market power are unregulated allowing BT Wholesale to charge lower prices and compete with the LLU operators. Exchanges in the latter market (covering 70% of the UK) are known as 'low cost areas'. Plusnet pass on the lower costs in these areas to customers. Unfortunately customers such as yourself in Market 1 and 2 areas do not benefit.
If Ofcom's regulatory policy encourages LLU operators to set up in your exchange in time it should become Market 3 (unregulated) and you would benefit too. So yes, prices could eventually reduce, but it requires competitors to establish a presence in your area, or a change in Ofcom policy.
More on this can be found on
Plusnet's 'Low Cost Areas' page.
Ofcom's Summary page; or the full works
Ofcom's Review of the wholesale broadband access markets
David
David
Message 21 of 24
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Re: £5 for 5GB - Split for discussion on potential speed advantages of ADSL2+
14-03-2010 9:48 PM
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Of course I am waiting for my exchange to be downgraded to Market 2 - why you ask
Sky
TalkTalk (CPW)
Tiscali - whoops! TalkTalk
AOL - whoops! TalkTalk
Who are these principal operators
Quote Market 3
Four or more 'principal' operators provide broadband services at this exchange. Service in this area has been deregulated!
Sky
TalkTalk (CPW)
Tiscali - whoops! TalkTalk
AOL - whoops! TalkTalk
Message 22 of 24
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Re: £5 for 5GB - Split for discussion on potential speed advantages of ADSL2+
14-03-2010 9:51 PM
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As David said....
However note that how many LLU providers there are is one of the measures of how competitive the exchange is, the other measure is having a certain number of homes it serves (I think 10,000). If you don't have enough houses served by your exchange, then unless there is a building spree locally, you will never become Market 3 area... unless you move home to a new area.
I think all Plusnet lines are run by BTw these days (they used to have some Tiscali LLU ones too, but I think they have all been changed back). So you will for the time being always have to pay the Market 1 prices, which aren't bad prices themselves. Note most suppliers pocket the Market3 extra profit for themselves anyway... so most suppliers charge EVERYONE the Market 1 price (regardless of where they live)! So it isn't that you are paying more for your line. You are paying the going rate... it is just that Plusnet have significantly lower costs for Market 3 and are pretty unique in passing that saving on to those end users.
Mike
However note that how many LLU providers there are is one of the measures of how competitive the exchange is, the other measure is having a certain number of homes it serves (I think 10,000). If you don't have enough houses served by your exchange, then unless there is a building spree locally, you will never become Market 3 area... unless you move home to a new area.
I think all Plusnet lines are run by BTw these days (they used to have some Tiscali LLU ones too, but I think they have all been changed back). So you will for the time being always have to pay the Market 1 prices, which aren't bad prices themselves. Note most suppliers pocket the Market3 extra profit for themselves anyway... so most suppliers charge EVERYONE the Market 1 price (regardless of where they live)! So it isn't that you are paying more for your line. You are paying the going rate... it is just that Plusnet have significantly lower costs for Market 3 and are pretty unique in passing that saving on to those end users.
Mike
Message 23 of 24
(518 Views)
Re: £5 for 5GB - Split for discussion on potential speed advantages of ADSL2+
15-03-2010 9:09 AM
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Went up to Brother in Laws yesterday, moaning about speed, so was going to change to - swear word coming - Talk Talk, as the would fit an accelerator/amplifier for him, small exchange, 1127 residents, no LLU and 5 km from exchange, Normington on Trent, coverage map below.
Warned him not to touch BB with a bargepole and that they were liers, more swear, he is currently on Sky, gave him PN details
Warned him not to touch BB with a bargepole and that they were liers, more swear, he is currently on Sky, gave him PN details
Message 24 of 24
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