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Noise Margin

Grafter
Posts: 136
Registered: ‎23-11-2009

Noise Margin

My noise margin has been raised form 8db-11db and Profile down from 6000Kbps to 5000Kbps over this weekend, I lost sync yesterday twice and had to reboot a couple of times for it to get back up and working, is it true that i have to wait 14 days for it to go back down?
Sat, 2009-11-28 17:04:48 - Loss of synchronization :1
Sat, 2009-11-28 17:05:47 - LCP down.
Sat, 2009-11-28 17:05:48 - Loss of synchronization :2
Sat, 2009-11-28 17:05:49 - LCP down.

ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 6848 kbps 448 kbps
Line Attenuation 18 db 5.5 db
Noise Margin 11 db 24 db
299 REPLIES 299
Community Veteran
Posts: 38,460
Thanks: 1,034
Fixes: 62
Registered: ‎15-06-2007

Re: Noise Margin

No it unfortunately isn't true.
It may well take well over 3 weeks but only if your line is stable with low error rates.
If it isn't stable or the errors are still considered high by the automated system it won't reduce at all.
However and this is rather important looking at your stats I would start checking your internal wiring.
Can you connect the router to the test socket with nothing else connected and report the stats.
Grafter
Posts: 136
Registered: ‎23-11-2009

Re: Noise Margin

Tryed master socket heres some graphs, What are the blips? .
Grafter
Posts: 136
Registered: ‎23-11-2009

Re: Noise Margin

Uptime for the router is 21:25:04. no log errors.


Today 11:13 4610 kbps (576kB/s) 372 kbps (46.5kB/s) Share
Today 10:20 4607 kbps (576kB/s) 372 kbps (46.5kB/s) Share
Today 01:35 4613 kbps (577kB/s) 373 kbps (46.6kB/s) Share
Today 01:01 4607 kbps (576kB/s) 371 kbps (46.4kB/s) Share
Today 00:17 4635 kbps (579kB/s) 373 kbps (46.6kB/s) Share
Yesterday 23:15 4602 kbps (575kB/s) 372 kbps (46.5kB/s) Share
Yesterday 20:36 4355 kbps (544kB/s) 368 kbps (46kB/s) Share
Yesterday 13:35 4573 kbps (572kB/s) 371 kbps (46.4kB/s) Share
Yesterday 13:33 4571 kbps (571kB/s) 373 kbps (46.6kB/s) Share
Yesterday 10:54 4881 kbps (610kB/s) 368 kbps (46kB/s) Share
Grafter
Posts: 136
Registered: ‎23-11-2009

Re: Noise Margin

Smiley Hello found out that it was my laptop making the blips on the graph, on HomePc now.
I'm using a Netgear DG834 V1  V3.01.38,  is it normal after losing sync for the noise margin to fluctuate?
Going to leave it for a couple of weeks to see if my IP will increase...

Community Veteran
Posts: 19,107
Thanks: 452
Fixes: 21
Registered: ‎31-08-2007

Re: Noise Margin

That noise graph is absolutely horrible, there is something very wrong here, especially as you seem close to the exchange you should sync at 8128 with a fairly large Noise Margin. Something is very intermittent. Do I understand these results are from being plugged into the test socket as per Oldjim's picture?
First please check your phone line -  can you hear/have you heard any crackling or other intermittent noise on the line? Dial a 1 to get rid of the dial tone. If you need more time before the NUT (number unobtainable tone) dial the quiet line test 17070 option 2. (Don't use any ringback or other test). Who is your Telephone Line Rental provider?
Can you also post the results from http://www.speedtester.bt.com/ - (you need Java Runtime Environment installed for this to work - the latest version for your OS).
Login to https://portal.plus.net/my.html?action=data_transfer_speed and advise what it says for your current profile/line speed.
If your graph wasn't from the Test socket could you give an Outline description of your installation -
1) Do you have an NTE5 Master LineBox (the type with the removeable lower front plate) and which logo it has on it.?
2) Whether you have any fixed extension wiring and sockets & how many, and roughly how the cables go from one to another;
3) What filters do you have and where is the Modem/Router plugged in?
4) Do you have a corded phone, do you have a cordless phone - if so what type - DECT or Analogue?
5) Is any other POTS (plain old telephone service) equipment (Faxes, Answer phones, Sky boxes or Alarms systems etc) plugged in/connected.
Community Veteran
Posts: 26,786
Thanks: 990
Fixes: 10
Registered: ‎10-04-2007

Re: Noise Margin

If your noise margin looks like that all day the first thing to suspect would be a noisy line.
My second guess would be something electrical that is on all the time. Is your router very near something electrical that is on all the time (I'm including PCs, monitors or printers etc. in that)?
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
Broadband: Andrews & Arnold Home::1 (FTTC 80/20)
Line rental: Pulse 8 Home Line Rental (£14.40/month)
Mobile: iD mobile (£4/month)
Grafter
Posts: 136
Registered: ‎23-11-2009

Re: Noise Margin

Thanks for reply, we moved into this house on November 9th, There was no line box so we got BT to install a new one
and put an extension in the kitchen, week later I signed up to O2 and with there modem I can remember connection speed was around
7500 and noise margin was 8db, wasnt getting good speeds in the evening like everyone else so cancelled and joined Plusnet.
Theres no noise at all from the phone line.
It doenst make a difference if i connect via the master socket i get ramdon connection speeds?Huh
Anotherone question's>
1) Do you have an NTE5 Master LineBox (the type with the removeable lower front plate) and which logo it has on it.?
  Answer: Yes, Open Reach Logo (BT Installed)
2) Whether you have any fixed extension wiring and sockets & how many, and roughly how the cables go from one to another;
  Answer: Yes, one extension, one cable to line box (BT Installed)
 
3) What filters do you have and where is the Modem/Router plugged in?
  Answer: Still have two 02 filters (Installed), just bought new ones BT MF50/Excelsus not used. Modem currently in Line Box
  DG834v1 & WTG624 v2.
4) Do you have a corded phone, do you have a cordless phone - if so what type - DECT or Analogue?
  Answer: Corded Phone in extension, no cordless phones.
5) Is any other POTS (plain old telephone service) equipment (Faxes, Answer phones, Sky boxes or Alarms systems etc) plugged
  in/connected

  Answer: None
Grafter
Posts: 136
Registered: ‎23-11-2009

Re: Noise Margin

BT Speedtester:
Download speedachieved during the test was - 4268 Kbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speeds is 600-7150 Kbps.
Additional Information:
Your DSL Connection Rate :7104 Kbps(DOWN-STREAM), 448 Kbps(UP-STREAM)
IP Profile for your line is - 5000 Kbps
PlusNet:
Phone exchange:
CHIRK
Estimated line speed:
6 - Checked on 2009-11-06 18:54:58
Current line speed:
5000
Going to monitor things now if anything eletrical is distrubing the router.
Community Veteran
Posts: 19,107
Thanks: 452
Fixes: 21
Registered: ‎31-08-2007

Re: Noise Margin

Thanks for your answers. You are going to need to do some double checking, although it's BT installed it can still go wrong!
Unfortunately you are going to need to plug into that test socket (as per the picture in reply #1). I'd use one of your BT MF50 filters, so it's different from what you've had connected, first try your other modem/router - collect some stats and noise margin graphs and note how many time the connection drops over what period (should be able to get that info from the stats). Then do the same with the current modem/router.
If you can post Noise graphs from the other modem/router and stats as soon as you are able, so we can do some comparisons with your previous posts until you can post the latter lot.
Grafter
Posts: 136
Registered: ‎23-11-2009

Re: Noise Margin

Thanks for helping us, at the moment I am just monitoring with everything in the home eletrical off not including pc & router,  stats are still very wild? Sad
going to borrow another router tomorrow and do some more tests.



"Man went into a bar, he only had one arm. Guy sitting next to him said 'Hey, you've got your sleeve in my drink', man replied, 'There's no (h)arm in it' " Tommy Cooper
Community Veteran
Posts: 26,786
Thanks: 990
Fixes: 10
Registered: ‎10-04-2007

Re: Noise Margin

Don't rule out the PC. I've seen an example where the PCs power supply was packing up and causing problems with the ADSL. If your router is near the PC try moving it as far away as the wires permit and make sure the router to filter wire is also well away.
The graph you posted in reply 2 showed the noise margin varying around two distinct levels, have you managed to identify what causes that? That graph is very indicative of something going on and off for short periods (fridge or freezer?).
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
Broadband: Andrews & Arnold Home::1 (FTTC 80/20)
Line rental: Pulse 8 Home Line Rental (£14.40/month)
Mobile: iD mobile (£4/month)
Grafter
Posts: 136
Registered: ‎23-11-2009

Re: Noise Margin

Hello again, havent done any more testing yet, waiting to see if my profile will change.
Connection Time 72:22:11
Connecting to Server Connected
Negotiation Success
Authentication Success

Download speedachieved during the test was - 4355 Kbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speeds is 600-7150 Kbps.
Additional Information:
Your DSL Connection Rate :7104 Kbps(DOWN-STREAM), 448 Kbps(UP-STREAM)
IP Profile for your line is - 5000 Kbps

I have managed to connected at 6500 before, up for 72hrs doesnt look like budging.
Grafter
Posts: 136
Registered: ‎23-11-2009

Re: Noise Margin

Smiley  Ip profile at 6000kpbs now, just waiting for plusnet to give it a nudge Wink
Grafter
Posts: 83
Registered: ‎08-08-2008

Re: Noise Margin

Nudged.