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Changed filter, IP profile increased, speed yet to?

Community Veteran
Posts: 6,735
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Registered: ‎02-02-2008

Re: Changed filter, IP profile increased, speed yet to?

My only doubts about requesting a change now is that BT appear to have become very obstinate about this sort of thing recently and want to see evidence of a good period of stability first. So far it's only 3 days since the filter swap and I doubt if that would be accepted as a "stuck profile".
That's why i suggested leaving it to see if the automatic processes do reduce it as they are supposed to.
Anyway, no harm in asking I guess.
Community Veteran
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Registered: ‎31-08-2007

Re: Changed filter, IP profile increased, speed yet to?

I was just about to post and lost the post, so HP has beaten me to my first point. As I've already said be patient. Whilst Oldjim's advise is technically correct, it is too soon to ask for a SNRM reduction as a stable line has not yet been demonstrated. Things look encouraging, but we need a few days of stats, not just a few hours.
Community Veteran
Posts: 19,106
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Registered: ‎31-08-2007

Re: Changed filter, IP profile increased, speed yet to?

Whilst things look encouraging, there are a couple of inconsistencies we should try to get to the bottom of.
Quote from: alben
I have just restarted my router and things have improved..........................I have done a quiet line test and there is little discernable noise, but I do know I am a fair distance from the exchange. Anyway I have never had speeds above 3000 so any increase  I do get is a bonus Smiley

How far (roughly) do you believe you are from the exchange (the route the cable would go - by road usually, but if you are rural it may go via a field!)?
The barely discernable noise - can you try and describe as best you can, or confirm, it should be steady and unchanging, if you have good hearing and a good phone it really shouldn't be any more than what I perhaps may describe as a 'presence' at worst a gentle 'shhhh' not a hiss a such, and certainly no crackles that come and go - no matter how quiet, and no radio noise or crosstalk either!
The good news is that over the period already reported your SNRM seem fairly steady, and whilst your router is not misreporting the sync speed (line rate) - confirmed by the BT speedtest - HP has already pointed out it is misreporting tx power and I suspect downstream line attenuation is misreported, because if it were right you should be able to get maximum sync rate, however the reported figure is inconsistent with the upstream attenuation. Assuming you haven't got some wierd line fault, if the attenuation is near what I'm guessing, you should still be able to achieve a 6M profile with a sync speed around 7M.
Are you able to borrow another router just to confrm our suspicions? Any checking / re-syncing (which should be kept to an absolute minimum) should occur in daylight hours ideally at an optimal time.
For background information we also need to know, have you had any telephone line faults which have been fixed of late and do you have any internal extensions, are your tests being carried out at the "test" socket?
Finally, just to re-state, ideally keep the router on, do not re-boot or if  you must, then no more than once a day ideally at an optimal (away from sunrise or sunset) time - when the SNRM is greatest. When swapping filters/routers etc for testing avoid more than 5 re-syncs in any hour, otherwise the exchange will assume an unstable line.
Hope that all helps, regards.
alben
Grafter
Posts: 101
Registered: ‎01-09-2007

Re: Changed filter, IP profile increased, speed yet to?

Thanks Oldjim and HPsauce, I think I will wait a while and see if the automatic process works. Should I continue to post stats, have just taken those below.
Statistics                                    Downstream                        Upstream
Line Rate                                    5312 Kbps                          448 Kbps
Attainable Line Rate                5920 Kbps                          1140 Kbps
Noise Margin                            15.1 dB                                  22.0 dB
Line Attenuation                        26.0 dB                                  21.0 dB
Output Power                            12.3 dBm                              19.8 dBm
alben
Grafter
Posts: 101
Registered: ‎01-09-2007

Re: Changed filter, IP profile increased, speed yet to?

Anotherone, I am 2.9km by road from the Exchange. I have just repeated the quiet line test, on the phone by the PC no noise at all, just a presence, on the phone at the master socket a very low steady hum, no crackles, I tried a spare phone and got the same result. Perhaps it is the filter, the noise margin drops from 15.8 to 15.6 if I unplug it, I already had in mind to replace this one. I have never had a telephone line fault and have recently had BT test the line and it is OK. I have two extension sockets, the router is plugged into one of these, the other is not used at present, the bell wires are disconnected. I cannot easily move the router to the test socket as my PC is connected to it by ethernet cable, childrens laptops are wireless but as they are revising for exams I do not think they will be keen to let me have the use of either of them.
Alan
alben
Grafter
Posts: 101
Registered: ‎01-09-2007

Re: Changed filter, IP profile increased, speed yet to?

Some more router stats
Statistics                                      Downstream                                    Upstream
Line Rate                                    5312 Kbps                                        448 Kbps
Attainable Line Rate                  5920 Kbps                                        1140 Kbps
Noise Margin                              14.2 dB                                              22.0 dB
Line Attenuation                        26.0 dB                                              21.0 dB
Output Power                            12.3 dBm                                          19.8 dBm
Community Veteran
Posts: 19,106
Thanks: 446
Fixes: 21
Registered: ‎31-08-2007

Re: Changed filter, IP profile increased, speed yet to?

Hi Alan,
Well done with the update, keep posting the stats for a while. That info. you have provided is great. That very minor change in SNRM doesn't suggest any problem with that filter, I'd expect changes like that to occurr as a matter of course. There will be no need to do any checks from the test socket PROVIDING the stability that we can see at the moment continues, and as such will demonstrate the you have no internal wiring problems etc. It sounds like the filter you discarded in the initial post may have been the cause of your recent problem. In fact the stabilty which appears to be showing at present suggests that you have a fairly low noise line, and should be able to achieve a 6M profile (sync at around 7M).
Your distance from the exchange is pretty well what I was guessing at (which coincidently is almost identical to my line) and I'd expect your downstream attenuation to be around 40dB but I'm not so lucky with noise which is presently higher than yours! As I said earlier, if you can borrow another router just to confirm those downstream figures that would be good.
The only thing that is niggling is how your target SNRM got to 15dB in the first place, bearing in mind in reply #7 you said you've NEVER had better than 3000 throughput. You may have had a period of high local interference some while ago which has now gone, or perhaps something like lightning caused the interference. The other possibilities are local works/factories etc which may still be on holiday and noise figures may change on Monday, is there anything nearby that may fit the bill? Lets hope not.
Chris.
Community Veteran
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Registered: ‎03-10-2008

Re: Changed filter, IP profile increased, speed yet to?

I'm following this with interest and especially with  Anotherone's expert views.
But is it worth reviewing the type of property. Is it a relatively new property - which was build by a major house builder and BT had to install new multi pared cables from the building / estate, in which case it would be new cable and maybe less likely to have issues, or is it a more established property, in a town or in a village where the cable may be fairly old.
I say this as my place is a new estate, BT put in a brand new multiple cable to the exchange and we have few problems.
In some properties in flats etc -there are more junction boxes  - and let's be honest may not have been of top quality.
alben
Grafter
Posts: 101
Registered: ‎01-09-2007

Re: Changed filter, IP profile increased, speed yet to?

Hi Anotherone, I suspect this filter may have been a problem all along, I seem to remember it came wiith my original PN modem when I was on a fixed rate service of 512kb, maybe it was not up to the spec for DSL Max.
Hi mal0z, my house is 10 years old, by a major builder. I am a retired BT engineer and have changed the front plate of the master socket and reterminated the extension sockets as well as disconecting the bell wires.
Statistics                                        Downstream                              Upstream
Line Rate                                      5312 Kbps                                  448 Kbps
Attainable Line Rate                    5920 Kbps                                  1140 Kbps
Noise Margin                                13.9 dB                                          22.0 dB
Line Attenuation                          26.0 dB                                          21.0 dB
Output Power                                12.3 dBm                                    19.8 dBm
Community Veteran
Posts: 19,106
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Registered: ‎31-08-2007

Re: Changed filter, IP profile increased, speed yet to?

Hi Alan,
Well Mal, we needn't worry about the wiring then eh  Wink
I shall refrain from telling granny how to suck eggs re line quality, possible dirty connections etc!!!! Embarrassed
Latest stats look good still Alan (except the misreported bits of course), slight drop in Noise Margin which is to be expected a this time of day, and not out of the way.
Any thoughts on past sources of interference?
Chris.
alben
Grafter
Posts: 101
Registered: ‎01-09-2007

Re: Changed filter, IP profile increased, speed yet to?

Hi Chris some further stats, The only thing that I can think of that may have caused interference was a cordless phone we had quite some time ago, we gave up on it because of noise problems.
Line Rate                                    5312 Kbps                    448 Kbps
Attainable Line Rate                5920 Kbps                    1140 Kbps
Noise Margin                            15.6 dB                            22.0 dB
Line Attenuation                        26.0 dB                          21.0 dB
Output Power                            12.3 dBm                        19.8 dBm


alben
Grafter
Posts: 101
Registered: ‎01-09-2007

Re: Changed filter, IP profile increased, speed yet to?

More stats
Statistics                            Downstream                        Upstream
Line Rate                            5312 Kbps                            448 Kbps
Attainable Line Rate        5920 Kbps                            1140 Kbps
Noise Margin                    15.3 dB                                    22.0 dB
Line Attenuation                26.0 dB                                  21.0 dB
Output Power                    12.3 dBm                              19.8 dBm
Community Veteran
Posts: 19,106
Thanks: 446
Fixes: 21
Registered: ‎31-08-2007

Re: Changed filter, IP profile increased, speed yet to?

Things look very promising Alan.
C.
alben
Grafter
Posts: 101
Registered: ‎01-09-2007

Re: Changed filter, IP profile increased, speed yet to?

Thanks Chris, here are yet more stats, will try and post some more before bedtime.
Statistics                              Downstream                                Upstream
Line Rate                              5312 Kbps                                    448 Kbps
Attainable Line Rate          5920 Kbps                                    1140 Kbps
Noise Margin                      14.2 dB                                            22.0 dB
Line Attenuation                  26.0 dB                                            21.0 dB
Output Power                      12.3 dBm                                        19.8 dBm
Community Veteran
Posts: 6,735
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Registered: ‎02-02-2008

Re: Changed filter, IP profile increased, speed yet to?

Quote from: alben
Noise Margin                            15.6 dB                            22.0 dB

If you are going to resync that would be the sort of time to do it - high snrm.