BT sends threatening letter alleging copyright infringement

[#1]

Quote from: itsme

Quote from: Mav Do we want to be snooped on by yet another body. The BPI are not snooping they are downloading copyright material from this BT user.

Semantics.
So, are the BPI breaking copyright, too?

[#2]

Quote from: bartstope

we all have something to fear if your isp is sending out a letter threatening disconnection on the strength of evidence which could easily be misinterpreted. what next? email warnings for downloading too much midget porn?

The ISP is simply threatening to withdraw the use of their service to someone they have evidence to believe may be acting illegally.
Why not?
I thing this is one occasion when BT is acting sensibly...

[#3]

Interesting. That seems to be going a stage further than what I've seen before.
The ones I've seen before appeared to be aimed at the "casual" sharer and were more of a "shot across the bows". That seems to be aimed at a more heavyweight/volume/commercial/professional target maybe?

[#4]

mod:note
OK Gentlemen please can I ask that we drop the porn comments, they are unnecessary and rude. And Off the original topic.
Jonathan
aka Chilly

[#5]

What if somebody else use's your static ip address when using software to cover their own ip address?
In addition what if somebody piggy backs your router?
Can they prove beyond reasonable doubt you commited the crime in an english court?
If they cut off your internet account just find an isp who won't work with BPI or setup an overseas isp
puddy

[#6]

Quote

If they cut off your internet account just find an isp who won't work with BPI or setup an overseas isp

That looks like an admission of guilty conduct -  I have absolutely no sympathy

[#7]

This is nothing to do with courts or legal proof. Any provider of any service can refuse your custom if they wish to.
In this case BT clearly has adequate reason, though they have no obligation even to say what that is.

[#8]

Quote from: puddy

If they cut off your internet account just find an isp who won't work with BPI or setup an overseas isp

How would an overseas-only ISP deliver broadband in the UK?
And any UK ISP is subject to the law so cannot ignore formal court proceedings, which is presumably what BPI would resort to if they were "unhelpful".

[#9]

It's hard to know where to stand on this.
For example, suppose trading standards had strong suspicians that your local corner shop was selling alcohol to under-age children.  To prove this, they enlist the assistance of an underage child to attempt to purchase alcohol - thereby breaking the law themselves, but proving their case.
In this case, the BPI are simply sitting in their office with a computer hooked up to Limewire (or whatever), and searching out copyrighted material - totally within their rights to do so.  From the information provided by the software, they can see exactly where it's coming from and who the ISP is.  Generally this information is publicly available (or at least it was the last time I downloaded anything on uTorrent), so all they are doing is alerting ISPs to possible breaches of contracts and law-breaking activities.
On the other hand, it should be down to the ISPs in general to work to block copyright theft and not have to rely on the assistance of other bodies.

[#10]

My take on this is a strange one.  If the BPI are activly connecting to a torrent and downloading an MP3 from your system, they are in effect sharing it themselves.  Now the BPI would not be allowed to break the law themselves (the alcohol one isn't really pertinent, the child is not breaking the law by buying, the store holder is breaking the law by selling) which means they have to have permission to share the file.
File sharing works on a permission based system, you really shouldn't share anything unless you have the legal right to share it, and are able to pass on the legal rights.  So if the BPI connects to a torrent and starts to share a file they have a legal right to share, then, due to the nature of a torrent (and the need to share) they should then, by default, transfer all rights they hold to share the file to every person they connect to on the swarm.
So, when they write to the ISP saying "ya, we downloaded this file!" the ISP should really say "yes, which means you forfit your rights to the copyright of that file because you transfer them by the act of sharing".  Until it goes to court however and a judge rules either way, the BPI will bully ISP's.

[#11]

Quote from: itsme

Have been tested in the courts way back in 2005, at this time there were a spate of court cases Telegraph

Been there seen there donit, Guilty my lord

[#12]

Quote from: dgwebb

If the BPI are activly connecting to a torrent and downloading an MP3 from your system, they are in effect sharing it themselves.

No, they are accessing it, not sharing it.
And I'll bet their T's&C's with the copyright holders will permit them to do that. After all they are representing and "protecting" those people so they would have it covered surely.

[#13]

This is a good debate chaps. It's a topic we discuss quite regularly (Dave T has blogged a couple of times about it), and we keep abreast of developments in the area. I think that article will answer the questions being asked in this thread from our perspective. I would add that PlusNet operates as a separate business unit from BT and as such policy decisions applied to customers on the BT Retail network aren't applied to customers using ours.
We have in the past taken action where we have been legally obliged to and we have also chosen to pass on warnings received from lawyers acting on behalf of copyright holders where we felt that was an appropriate action.
Ian

[#14]

I welcome Plusnet's stance towards the File sharing issue after all last time I looked ISP stood for Internet Service Provider and not Inernet Service Police.

Quote from: Ian

PlusNet operates as a separate business unit from BT and as such policy decisions applied to customers on the BT Retail network aren't applied to customers using ours.

However the above passage caught my eye and I hope I am not being picky or going off-topic  Plusnet maybe be seperate from BT Retail  but there is a difference between separate and independent.

[#15]

Hmmm - I think you are being a bit picky, but I can certainly understand people being interested in the relationship between us and BT. It's probably a good topic for a blog in it's own right, but because I'm about to go on holiday that will have to wait!
In short I'd say that we have adopted certain BT ways of doing things, our network security standards for example, but for most things BT really do give us independence. Like any owner they expect certain results to be delivered, but the decisions we make that lead to those results being achieved are entirely our call.
Ian