topic Re: *ix in Tech Help - Software/Hardware etc

*ix

Anonymous — Thu, 13 Feb 2025 22:23:37 GMT

I'm interested in opinions/data/whatever of peoples' experiences of migraing to a *ix-based desktop. I have (well in the past) used unix and some flavours thereof. Reasons for asking? I'm just getting irritated by feature-creep in Windoze.

Re: *ix

outcast — Thu, 13 Feb 2025 23:02:03 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:

... peoples' experiences of migraing to a *ix-based desktop.

Are you suggesting that using Unix desktop could be a massive headache ? (i.e. migraine) 🙄

Re: *ix

outcast — Thu, 13 Feb 2025 22:59:36 GMT

For clarification, when you say *ix, do you mean *ix, or *ux ?

I'm not sure you'll get many replies for *ix

but many people here are using *ux

Re: *ix

Anonymous — Thu, 13 Feb 2025 23:46:36 GMT

linux

unix

Delete the 'n', delete the 'u', and both are similar. For the 'l' of it.

Re: *ix

jab1 — Fri, 14 Feb 2025 07:17:26 GMT

Let's just say I migrated to a Linux distro after almost 30 years of MS and apart from having to learn the differences between 'command line' and 'terminal' , it was super easy.

The added advantages are you don't have to wait a couple of hours for it to configure after an update, you choose when to run the updates/restarts(if required), and you can almost guarantee that you don't have to buy new kit every time they release a new version.

I'm running the latest release on a laptop which is around 14 years old (as a test bed), although my production machine is only about 4 y.o.

I would never go back to a Windows rig if you paid me.

Re: *ix

Dan_the_Van — Fri, 14 Feb 2025 08:45:41 GMT

@Anonymous

I just ignore the more annoying features of Windows, I would imagine you are looking for a 'linux' distro, these links have popular versions.

https://zorin.com/os/

https://www.linuxmint.com/

https://ubuntu-mate.org/about/

https://ubuntu.com/desktop/flavours

Personally I do not have a preference as they all have there good and bad points.

For what it is worth I currently have, Windows 10, 11, linux lite, Mate, Mint and Debian. You will need to install 'wine' on a linux distro if you want to use windows based applications

Re: *ix

jab1 — Fri, 14 Feb 2025 08:49:35 GMT

@Dan_the_Van I don't know about the bottom three links, but Zorin OS comes with WINE pre-installed.

Re: *ix

Dan_the_Van — Fri, 14 Feb 2025 09:03:21 GMT

@jab1

Yes zorin does have 'wine' preinstalled which was a reason I tried it for a windows 7 replacement system, but I didn't really take to it so that experiment didn't last long.

Re: *ix

Anonymous — Fri, 14 Feb 2025 09:07:21 GMT

@Anonymous

I first tried out Linux about 15 years ago, when I found that my desktop scanner was not supported by the manufacturer under the brand new Windows 7 that I had just bought via my employer.

Ubuntu Linux had no trouble with it.

I moved to Linux Mint, (Cinnamon), about 10 years ago and have stayed with it ever since on all of my PCs.

I have tried out most versions of Windows since 7, usually when I buy a new, (to me), PC and test that it is working properly before wiping it and installing Linux! Windows stopping supporting things is a common occurrence I have found.

There are a few things that I still need Windows for, the channel editor for our Sony TV being one. For that, I have Windows 11 installed on an external SSD that I can boot any PC in to when required, without affecting the Linux installation.

Are you aware that you have a couple of options to try out Linux before commiting to it?

1.) Live Mode

With many Linux distros, (eg Mint), you can download the ISO file, burn it to a DVD or USB flash drive and boot the PC in to that, without affecting the existing Windows installation. The only real disadvantage of this is that Lnux runs more slowly, (particularly from DVD), than if it was installed.

2.) Dual Boot

If after trying Live Mode, you want to try installing Linux on your PC, but don't yet want to wipe off Windows, you can install Linux to "Dual Boot":

Within Windows, use the Disk Management tool to shrink the Windows partition, leaving you a section of free space. Run the Linux installer and you will get to a stage where you have a choice to wipe the drive and install Linux or install it side-by-side with Windows - choose that one. When you reboot. you will be given the choice of which OS to boot in to.

If you later decide that you want to remove either Windows or Linux and just have one OS installed, this is easy to do and the newly free space can be recovered.

Re: *ix

jab1 — Fri, 14 Feb 2025 09:08:15 GMT

Fair enough, @Dan_the_Van . Strangely enough, when I was looking to change, I tried Mint, Mate and a couple of other distros and although I could use them, I found Zorin was the easiest. Horses for courses, I suppose.

Re: *ix

MisterW — Fri, 14 Feb 2025 09:14:41 GMT

Can I add a third option to that,

Run Linux in a Virtual machine. I tend to use Virtualbox but Windows does have built in Virtualization.

Linux runs pretty well in a VM, and you have an advantage that you can run Windows and Linux simultaneously.

Re: *ix

shutter — Fri, 14 Feb 2025 09:44:53 GMT

I started to think about moving away from Windows a long time ago... and started to "learn" about Linux Mint on version 8. progressing with every new version up to current Linux Mint 22.

New versions come along but you do not have to have it...!... from my experience, it seems to have little effect on the actual user experience... I just get the new version when I am ready for it, and keep my machine(s) up to date that way.

I have a particular program that was written for Windows 95.... and I wanted to find out if there was a way of getting the program to run on Linux Mint. It took me a while, but eventually, through trial and error, and queries posted on the "then" Tech Board, with help and guidance from " those who knew " back then... I managed to DUMP WINDOWS COMPLETELY when Win 7 stopped being supported for updates.

I run about 45 "windows" softwares on my main laptop ASUS ROG and on my older Toshiba 10inch laptop.

There is only one program that I now rarely use, but did use a lot back then, and needed to be able to access the documents saved over the years, and still use the program occasionally now... It is Microsoft Publisher 98. I run this in a "virtual box". which sounds complicated to some..but once "installed and set up" and leaned, it is just a matter of clicking on an ICON on the desktop, to access it.. and work on MS PUB 98

WINE 9.0 is the latest version and that acts like a "wardrobe" ..i.e. it is just a basic form of WIndows, that you can hang all your other "windows" software on. and access from your desktop menu or icons on the desktop. just like you are running windows anyway. ....

There are several ways to install WINE.. but the best way ( I personally found ) is to google "How to install WINE on Linux XX XXX" from there you just need to follow the "copy and paste" instructions on to the "TERMINAL" ( aka command line window)

it takes about 45 mins to install, completely but, as mentioned by @jab1 and @Dan_the_Van, it is easy to use.

The transition is a learning curve.. but well worth the effort

If you have used LINUX before, it will not be so much of a learning curve.

UPDATES are offered on a "simple basis"... i.e... if some "part(s)" of Linux needs updating, or some other apps/software needs wholly updating, then you will get a notification on the "lower task bar". you are then just a few clicks away from being fully updated within minutes - at not cost to your time ! ...

Linux updates bits and pieces, so they usually only take a couple of minutes and can be run in the background while you continue working on other stuff... On completion , your "update manager" will inform you that it has been done and you are up to date.

Occasionally, you may also see that you need to "restart for the update to take effect".. however... this does not mean you have to "do it now".. you can leave that until you shut down at night, and next morning`s "restart" will have the effect.. you WILL NOT HAVE TO WAIT for the machine to shut down and then wait another couple of hours for it to "configure updates" and start up again, ..

In the morning, ( or next time you start the machine) you will not even notice that your machine has updated. it will start as normal.

Linux Mint ( and other distros) has a very extensive software store ( Software Manager ) so that if your favourite windows app does not run on WINE after installing.. you can uninstall it, and see if there is a Linux alternative.. Software is termed "package" or "packages" if several are involved.

Terminology is something you might need to google to find the answer of what it means...

If the windows software is "essential" ( as was the case for me with MS PUB 98 ) do not fret... you can install VirtualBox, and run a version of Windows from downloaded to USB .iso file.

A big advantage with LINUX is that you can install it from a USB "live" version, on to any machine.. and with HDD or SSD, that is removable, You can then transfer all your documents files folders etc, to the "new/donor" Linux machine HDD/SSD.

Once you have completed that.. you can then swap the HDD/SSD from the "donor" machine, in to your current machine, ( you can even keep a version on a USB on a key ring and plug that in to your mate`s machine, ) keeping your windows version as a "back up".

WINDOWS on Virtual Box... this is a big advantage..because, you can run any version ** of WINDOWS (or several versions) and you DO NOT NEED TO register it to Microsoft... yeah.. it will nag you to do so,.. but it will still work.. just won`t get updates..You won`t need them i so long s you are not going to be "on line" transferring your wealth to your offshore account(s) ! ! ! !

** not sure if Window 11 will work on VB... someone else may know......

Well Worth the EFFORT and no more worries about updates causing your machine to die on you...or, ( as already mentioned) you do not need to buy a new machine to have the latest version installed on it,

ZORIN does have WINE inlcuded.. BUT you need to activate it by trying to install a Windows software... once you have done that for your first go, it will then go through the motions of installing WINE.. and then the Windows software. on completion, your next windows software install ( and subsequents ) will install "normally"

Re: *ix

Anonymous — Fri, 14 Feb 2025 10:00:40 GMT

@shutter wrote:

"WINE 9.0 is the latest version"

I am running Wine v10.1, so I'm guessing that you are on the "Stable" rather than the "Development" branch?

Re: *ix

shutter — Fri, 14 Feb 2025 10:08:18 GMT

@Anonymous Yup .... just the "normal" ..... does what it says on the tin

Running Linux Mint 22 WILMA... and just checked ( via terminal request ) for wine --version and got

wine-9.0 (Ubuntu 9.0~repack-4build3)

Re: *ix

corringham — Fri, 14 Feb 2025 14:54:59 GMT

@MisterW wrote:
Run Linux in a Virtual machine. I tend to use Virtualbox but Windows does have built in Virtualization.

WSL (Windows support for Linux) is now a very robust way to run a Linux system on a Windows machine, and it coexists with Windows just fine. It will automatically install several distributions (e.g. Ubuntu).

I run numerous machines - both Linux and Windows, as well as Windows on Linux (in Virtualbox), Linux on Windows (Virtualbox and WSL) and on Linux (VirtualBox). Unless you have special requirements, I'd suggest WSL is the best place to start.

Re: *ix

shutter — Fri, 14 Feb 2025 18:28:15 GMT

@corringham Yeah, But...... running Linux on a WINDOWS laptop.... seems a bit of a waste. especially when you will need a new laptop to be able to run windows 12 and future versions.

The idea of running Linux is so that you do not have to keep buying a new laptop/desktop/tower machine every time Microsoft says so....!

With Linux as your MAIN operating system...you can run "any old" windows versio in a virtual box as a "back up" or "just because you actually NEED windows for a specific program/sofware... like I did with MS PUB98 , ...all my other windows programs/softares run in WINE ... ON the LINUX o.s. with no virtual box for them ....!

AND... as a PLUS to that... if you have a laptop with a removable HDD/SSD.. you can buy a new laptop WITHOUT WINDOWS ( save a few quid ) . and put your existing HDD/SSD into that machine, and run it...n (Or...you could just "clone the hdd" to a usb, or direct to the new laptop/machine of choice !)

Can`t do that with Windows,... it is tied to the machine it is installed on.... Hmm ..now there`s a thought ! 😀

Re: *ix

corringham — Fri, 14 Feb 2025 19:22:50 GMT

I agree Native Linux is better - if you know what you want. I was really suggesting WSL as a way to try distributions out without committing to one without using it for a while first.

I still use a 10 year old laptop running Linux Mint, and it is quite usable (for most things). I don't use it much though as I have several high end desktops running Ubuntu that I use most of the time.

As far as Windows goes, unless you have a dodgy HP (or other vendor specific) Windows licence, you can actually move your Windows to a new machine - I do it quite often. You can buy legitimate generic Windows keys quite cheaply from resellers such as UnitySoft - you can download the ISOs direct from Microsoft.

Re: *ix

Anonymous — Fri, 14 Feb 2025 23:50:20 GMT

I will say "thank you" to all replies (there may be more?). These are opinions/observations which are important and appreciated. I will read, consider and digest. But if there are more?

For the sake of history, I've used Ultrix, AIX, BSD, SunOS (with shells) in the dim and distant past. But someone influenced the path of the preferred 'OS' for a whole multinational and I got stuck in the Microsoft groove.

My brain can't disassociate Linus Torvalds from Torvilll and Dean (Bolero) and thus Ravel. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r30D3SW4OVw. The human mind works in very peculiar manners. And history is even weirder. Who remembers that Windows after '98 was in effect a borged VMS (what was DEC's operating system)? I remember the code comment "The starlet has twinkled". and core security executables were CIA.EXE and FBI.EXE. The UK influence was the concept of the microfortnight. Which was an actual parameter.

Re: *ix

corringham — Sat, 15 Feb 2025 09:52:52 GMT

I've used several of flavours of Unix as well as lots of other OSs - I helped develop several. I used to have a microVAX at home in the 1990s which ran VMS - although I did most of my development work on an accelerated Amiga 3000 in those days. That could run AmigaOS or Unix System V R5. That was handy when I was working on System V for Siemens BS2000 mainframes.

Ahh, nostalgia isn't what it used to be!

Re: *ix

MisterW — Sat, 15 Feb 2025 10:05:45 GMT

I used to have a microVAX at home in the 1990s which ran VMS

We still use VMS on microVAXs for development, although these days they're not real ones, they're virtualised on Linux or Windows Intel x64 hosts