topic Re: Are Plusnet abandoning ADSL customers? in Plusnet Feedback

Are Plusnet abandoning ADSL customers?

corringham — Mon, 11 Sep 2023 08:39:05 GMT

It appears that addresses with only ADSL2+ available cannot order any product from Plusnet now - there is of course no land-line option presented now, but also there are no broadband options - just an error message. With mobile also withdrawn, that leaves - er, nothing at all.

Incidentally, EE no longer offer any fixed line broadband at ADSL only addresses either - but at least they do offer mobile broadband plans.

Do Plusnet have any future plan for ADSL customers?

Re: Are Plusnet abandoning ADSL customers?

dvorak — Mon, 11 Sep 2023 09:40:43 GMT

Moderators Note

This topic has been moved from Broadband to Plusnet Feedback

Re: Are Plusnet abandoning ADSL customers?

corringham — Mon, 11 Sep 2023 10:05:43 GMT

OK, so a question about plans for broadband provision isn't appropriate in the Broadband section.

Re: Are Plusnet abandoning ADSL customers?

dvorak — Mon, 11 Sep 2023 10:18:05 GMT

No, because that's about help with your connection - not a generic PN broadband question.

Re: Are Plusnet abandoning ADSL customers?

corringham — Mon, 11 Sep 2023 10:25:12 GMT

The description "Get help with your Broadband connection here." doesn't tell me that you have to have a connection, just that you need help with one.

I've been asked by new neighbours about broadband. They had Plusnet suggested to them by another neighnour, but when they checked with Plusnet's website there is just an error message.

I no longer use Plusnet as I have an altnet FTTP connection, but I'm on the main road, and the altnet didn't build down the side road where the only option was ADSL - and now there's nothing available.

So my question is do Plusnet have any plans for ADSL only areas?

Re: Are Plusnet abandoning ADSL customers?

dvorak — Mon, 11 Sep 2023 10:30:56 GMT

As it's under the section of 'Help With My Plusnet Services' I'm pretty sure that does tell you.

Re: Are Plusnet abandoning ADSL customers?

corringham — Mon, 11 Sep 2023 10:34:51 GMT

I'm pretty certain it doesn't!

What category are you supposed to choose to ask a question about Broadband before you actually have a Plusnet connection?

Re: Are Plusnet abandoning ADSL customers?

dvorak — Mon, 11 Sep 2023 10:53:07 GMT

Everything Else, My Order, Tech Help?

Re: Are Plusnet abandoning ADSL customers?

bmc — Mon, 11 Sep 2023 11:09:13 GMT

@corringham

Use the following to see what's available at the address. If you don't know the phone number use the address version.

https://www.broadbandchecker.btwholesale.com/#/ADSL

Post a screen image ot the results hiding any personal details. I'm interested in what it says before I comment further.

Brian

Re: Are Plusnet abandoning ADSL customers?

corringham — Mon, 11 Sep 2023 11:14:10 GMT

@bmc, here's the output for the address checker:

ADSL Products	Downstream Line Rate (Mbps)	Upstream Line Rate (Mbps)	Downstream Range(Mbps)	Availability Date
WBC ADSL 2+	Up to 8	--	5.5 to 12.5	Available
WBC ADSL2+ Annex M	Up to 8	Up to 1	5.5 to 12.5	Available
ADSL Max	Up to 5.5	--	4.5 to 8	Available
WBC Fixed Rate	2	--	--	Available
Fixed Rate	2	--	--	Available

Other Offerings	Availability Date

Exchange Product Restrictions	Status
FTTP Priority Exchange	N
WLR Withdrawal	Y
SOADSL Restriction	Y

FTTP is not available.

The exchange is not in a current fibre priority programme

As a WLR withdrawal exchange, product restrictions apply

SOADSL is restricted at the exchange

For all ADSL and WBC Fibre to the Cabinet (VDSL or G.fast) services, the stable line rate will be determined during the first 10 days of service usage.

For all SOADSL services,the stable line rate will be determined during the first 10 days of service usage.

Actual speeds experienced by end users and quoted by CPs will be lower due to a number of factors within and external to BT's network, Communication Providers' networks and within customer premises.

In order to be eligible for handback, downstream speed should be less than Downstream Handback Threshold values.

ADSL, ADSL2+ and SOADSL availability: If shown at FTTP or SOGEA premises,ADSL, ADSL2+ and SOADSL are not available to order due to WLR Withdrawal stop sell rules. CPs should order FTTP or SOGEA. Copper products are only available by exception.

Thank you for your interest

Re: Are Plusnet abandoning ADSL customers?

corringham — Mon, 11 Sep 2023 11:19:58 GMT

@dvorak wrote:
Everything Else, My Order, Tech Help?

My Order - "Recently joined us or upgraded and have a question?" - not joined yet, so not applicable.

Tech Help - "For all talk about tech matters." - it's not really a tech issue, but a business policy issue so not a good fit.

Everything Else - "Anything else services related you need help with." - I guess that's the one. My bad.

Re: Are Plusnet abandoning ADSL customers?

Dan_the_Van — Mon, 11 Sep 2023 11:29:39 GMT

@corringham

I know they have been recommended plusnet, as it's ADSL perhaps they should look at TalkTalk or Sky as I believe the stop sell is not applicable to them

https://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2023/09/openreach-stops-selling-new-uk-analogue-copper-phone-lines.html

Re: Are Plusnet abandoning ADSL customers?

corringham — Mon, 11 Sep 2023 11:41:02 GMT

@Dan_the_Van , unfortunately neither Sky nor TalkTalk offer any broadband products here. I believe they are only available in LLU enabled exchanges, and ours has no LLU at all.

BT do appear to offer ADSL.

However, I think it is likely that they will go with EE 4G (there is a mast in line-of-sight).

Re: Are Plusnet abandoning ADSL customers?

MisterW — Mon, 11 Sep 2023 11:45:32 GMT

My reading (and it might be wrong) of the Openreach stop sell rules https://www.openreach.co.uk/cpportal/products/the-all-ip-programme/stopsell-updates is that there should be an exception where neither FTTP or SoGEA is available, and that ADSL & WLR should still be orderable. I guess PN automated systems MAY not be detecting the execptional circumstances

Re: Are Plusnet abandoning ADSL customers?

corringham — Mon, 11 Sep 2023 12:05:16 GMT

@MisterW , I think I've found the answer - the only product that would allow ADSL to be offered by an ISP is SOTAP., and I believe you are correct that the stop sell rules would allow that to be sold in this case.

However, the SOTAP description at https://www.openreach.co.uk/cpportal/products/copper/sotap states

To use SOTAP you’ll need a point of presence in an exchange based on local loop unbundling (LLU) infrastructure. Or you can go through a wholesaler who offers SOTAP in your area.

No ISP has a point of presence in our exchange, and there is no LLU infrastructure. So the only route for Plusnet (or any other ISP) to offer ADSL now is to go via BT Wholesale. EE are not doing that, so I expect Plusnet won't either. (it could be that BT Wholesale don't offer SOTAP as a wholesale product at all).

At the end of 2025 even SOTAP will become unavailable, so I expect it is best for locals to find an alternative now anyway as Opernreach have no plans for our exchange (at least up to 2030).

Re: Are Plusnet abandoning ADSL customers?

bmc — Mon, 11 Sep 2023 12:18:41 GMT

@corringham

Thanks for the information. As others have pointed out the Stop Sell on new copper lines has had an impact. A bit of tidying up though. SOTAP is for (digital) phone only. For ADSL2 you need SOADSL and you results indicate this is restricted at the premises.

PN might supply SOADSL but your new neighbours would have to phone PN sales and ask.

Brian

Re: Are Plusnet abandoning ADSL customers?

corringham — Mon, 11 Sep 2023 12:30:37 GMT

Just a quick update. I've spent an hour checking ISPs and broadband availability in the postcode area - the ONLY ISP I have found that can offer a fixed line broadband is BT, who can provide 3-5Mb ADSL2+ for £29.99pm.

4G is faster at 30Mbps for £35pm with EE (same deal is £70.32pm with BT)

I should maybe mention that 50 yards away Gigaclear offer 300Mbps symmetrical for £17pm (18 month term) - I use their 600Mbps deal.

@bmc, there doesn't appear to be any mention of SOADSL in the Openreach documents (only SOTAP).

Re: Are Plusnet abandoning ADSL customers?

bmc — Mon, 11 Sep 2023 13:08:02 GMT

@corringham

I didn't have much luck on OR either but I did find it in a news article. More importantly it's mentioned in the results you posted.

Brian

Re: Are Plusnet abandoning ADSL customers?

Archer — Mon, 11 Sep 2023 13:16:15 GMT

This discussion is along the same lines as Do PN do SOTAP, (title may be slightly wrong), from lasr week.

The additional bits of info were that apparently OR have not launched SOTAP yet so would allow ISP to choose ADSL via a WLR PSTN line until 28th March 2024.

This does not mean they have to, But as someone pointed out ISPs may think it is better to loose a few customers rather than go to the trouble of taking up a minority and temporary product.

I am due to renew just after the date above so will be watching this space closely.

Re: Are Plusnet abandoning ADSL customers?

corringham — Mon, 11 Sep 2023 14:29:13 GMT

@Archer wrote:

This discussion is along the same lines as Do PN do SOTAP, (title may be slightly wrong), from lasr week.

Although the details may differ a bit, it is the same issue really. Products are being withdrawn without much thought or planning going into what happens in cases where the preferred solution (FTTP or SOGEA and Digital Voice) aren't available.

Even SOTAP will go away at the end of 2025, yet there are areas where there are no fixed line alternatives available, and where OR have no plans this side of 2030.

Customers are being kept in the dark - I'm not sure whether that is deliberate, or because ISPs like Plusnet have no idea themselves.

As someone that is seen as technically proficient by neighbours, I often get asked for advice. Unfortunately, I'm not sure I can help choose a product when there is no satisfactory product available from any ISP!