topic Re: VAT INVOICE in Plusnet Feedback

VAT invoice

chris20 — Thu, 26 Jul 2018 23:12:37 GMT

I run a small business from home and I claim about 30% of my calls and Broadband on my company. Most of my calls are therefore private. Now Plusnet will not give me a VAT receipt (although they are legally bound to), without transferring me to a more expensive business account. I have had broadband with Plusnet for many years.

I rang support about this and was transferred to a business advisor whose only comment was: ' you are free to transfer to another provider'.

God knows how Plusnet have all these customer service awards!

I am now looking around for a better (and probably cheaper) provider.

Bye.

Moderator's note by Mike (Mav): All caps title/text edited as per Forum rules.

Re: VAT INVOICE

Strat — Thu, 26 Jul 2018 13:45:12 GMT

Moderator's note:

Topic moved from General Chat to Plusnet Feedback.

Re: VAT INVOICE

Baldrick1 — Thu, 26 Jul 2018 15:13:45 GMT

@chris20 wrote:

I run a small business from home and I claim about 30% of my calls and Broadband on my company.

From Plusnet terms and conditions:

2. Your use of the services

2.1.3. use the services for personal use in the UK (so don't use the services to run your own business, but a couple of work emails or occasional home working are okay) and in accordance with our Acceptable Use Policy;

Re: VAT INVOICE

chris20 — Thu, 26 Jul 2018 15:46:56 GMT

Dear Mr Baldrick1 'Seasoned Champion' - I presume you work for Plusnet?

So what about the other 70% of my residential usage? There must be millions of people that work from home that use a standard residential service. Why should I pay more for a 'service' that I dont want? I don't run an internet cafe or anything - just a few emails and phone calls.

Sounds like pure blackmail to me!

Re: VAT INVOICE

Baldrick1 — Thu, 26 Jul 2018 17:26:11 GMT

For information, I am a customer just like you. I am also critical of Plusnet where appropriate. It just irritates me when people expect either higher priority repairs (not the case in your post) or additional services because they are using the service in contravention of the Terms and Conditions with which the majority of us comply.

Re: VAT INVOICE

Townman — Thu, 26 Jul 2018 21:01:56 GMT

The only time an obligation to issue a VAT invoice arises is where BOTH supplier and consumer are VAT registered businesses. See http://stewartaccounting.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/Do-you-always-have-to-issue-a-VAT-invoice.pdf for a simplified explanation.

Small businesses if VAT registered ought to be using business grade accounts, for which VAT invoices will be provided.

Re: VAT INVOICE

chris20 — Fri, 27 Jul 2018 17:13:06 GMT

Yes Mr. Baldrick1 and co.

'It just irritates me...'

I am also irritated by your self-appointed guardianship of Plusnet's profit margin and this forum.
It costs them virtually nothing to issue a VAT receipt, they are just trying to increase revenue. After many years of my payments to them without a problem, they are changing T's and C's solely to benefit themselves.

You seem to spend most of your time using up far more of Plusnet's internet bandwidth than myself by posting all these messages!

I'm just stating that I consider this situation to be unfair.

Re: VAT INVOICE

Baldrick1 — Fri, 27 Jul 2018 20:34:26 GMT

@chris20 wrote:
I'm just stating that I consider this situation to be unfair.

And I respect that this is your view, but come on, this is a public forum and there's no need to be rude about those who disagree with you. Shall we just leave it at that?

Re: VAT INVOICE

andylloyd1 — Mon, 01 Oct 2018 21:06:48 GMT

The Law actually states that a retailer is obligated to provide a VAT receipt when requested, as a Tax payer you are entitled to know what tax you are paying. If enough people report Plusnet to HMRC for failing to obey the law. HMRC will hopefully do something. My advice simple move to a more customer friendly provider when your contract is due (Avoid BT as they are the worst)

Re: VAT INVOICE

Townman — Tue, 02 Oct 2018 14:38:14 GMT

Can you cite “the law” (linky would help) requiring a VAT RECEIPT please? I looked and all references of obligation refer to INVOICES between VAT registered parties - nothing in respect of RECEIPTS. If such an obligation can be verified, then there’s an issue to be addressed.

As for not issuing a VAT invoice somehow increases Plusnet’s Profits - can the author of that comment please explain how? The fact that it is not a “VALID” VAT invoice does not release the supplier from paying to HMRC the collected tax.

Re: VAT INVOICE

rjlunn — Wed, 03 Oct 2018 14:38:26 GMT

The following is coppied from the HMRC web site:-

To whom a VAT invoice must be issued
If you are a seller registered for VAT you must give a buyer who is registered for VAT a VAT invoice for any standard-rated or reduced-rated items sold. If you are a retailer, you do not need to issue a VAT invoice or receipt unless asked to do so by the buyer. A VAT registered supplier may be fined if they do not issue a VAT invoice when asked to do so by a VAT registered buyer.

Plusnet appear to be trying to force all customers who are able to reclaim any part of their VAT to open a business account at a more expensive rate than their residential account.

Re: VAT INVOICE

Townman — Wed, 03 Oct 2018 15:09:13 GMT

Can you provide the link please.

Re: VAT INVOICE

chris20 — Wed, 03 Oct 2018 15:47:59 GMT

Agree entirely!

There are lots of comments about this on this forum.

I always thought that PN lived up to their TV adverts, but they are just trying to make life difficult for some of us.

Re: VAT INVOICE

Townman — Wed, 03 Oct 2018 15:58:06 GMT

I have just been researching this topic, in doing so I have found reports of Sky, O2, Vodaphone and 3 not issuing VAT invoices to residential users and advising users that if they want VAT invoices they need to be on business grade services. However the Sky case I read had a catch 22 problem in that they would not supply business grade services to a residential address!!!

Re: VAT INVOICE

andylloyd1 — Thu, 04 Oct 2018 09:31:05 GMT

The only reason I can see why they are choosing not to issue VAT receipts is to make people change to a business account, which is no better than residential, but cost more, resulting in increased profits, for no extra work.

Plusnet along with some of the others have realised that a lot of people are running there businesses from home, like Ebay and Amazon shops etc, and they want a piece of the action. If you are VAT registered you can claim the VAT back.

For people like me who need the VAT figure to claim back on expenses by not showing the VAT figure on the receipt it makes it more difficult to claim.

It shows that Plusnet are only interested in profit and not individual customer needs. Its costs them nothing to put the VAT amount on a receipt and as stated before It is a legal requirement when asked for.

The legal people I spoke to said as long as you are a tax payer (you don't have to be VAT registered to be a tax payer) you are entitled to a full itemised invoice/receipt if you request one and this should show all charges including any taxes. Hopefully HMRC will chase them up and fine them.

In the mean time all I can suggest is vote with your feet and find an alternative supplier when your contract is up for renewal. the company I work for have asked me to move ASAP to a more amenable supplier.

Re: VAT INVOICE

Anonymous — Thu, 04 Oct 2018 10:44:50 GMT

@andylloyd1 wrote:
VAT amount on a receipt and as stated before It is a legal requirement when asked for.

This only applies when you yourself are a VAT registered entity and if you are then you should be using a Business grade service.

If anyone using a residential service who requires (needs) a VAT receipt then please by all means demand one from Plusnet and when they don't give you one complain to HMRC. Once you have done this make sure your accounts are in order as it won't be Plusnet's door HMRC will be knocking on!

Re: VAT INVOICE

chris20 — Thu, 04 Oct 2018 11:24:43 GMT

@andylloyd1 wrote:

'This only applies when you yourself are a VAT registered entity and if you are then you should be using a Business grade service.'

Please tell me why I should be using a Business grade service?

Are you affiliated with the Braundo company?

'If anyone using a residential service who requires (needs) a VAT receipt then please by all means demand one from Plusnet and when they don't give you one complain to HMRC. Once you have done this make sure your accounts are in order as it won't be Plusnet's door HMRC will be knocking on!'

Why are you insinuating that my accounts are not in order?? There must be millions of people who work at home intermittently and need a VAT receipt. All this is just about PN trying to extract more money for the same service.

Re: VAT INVOICE

Townman — Thu, 04 Oct 2018 11:40:42 GMT

Fact: where the value is under £25 a vat invoice is not essential.

As reported above this is common practise.

An obligation only arises if both parties are VAT registered. If your employer needs you to have Internet service at home, they should be contracting for it direct, then there would be a VAT registered entity to VAT registered entity relationship.

The T&Cs are clear - not for business use.

I can understand that people do not like it, but that’s what we all signed up to.

Re: VAT INVOICE

Anonymous — Thu, 04 Oct 2018 11:47:42 GMT

I assume you really meant to @ me @chris20 considering it's my post you're quoting.

If you don't know the answer to that by now then nothing I can say will help you.

I wasn't implying anything about your accounts or indeed anyone else's.

If you NEED a VAT receipt that implies you are in business, so get the correct product to allow you to do this and stop bleating.

Re: VAT INVOICE

andylloyd1 — Thu, 04 Oct 2018 17:36:26 GMT

To Towman

You are assuming that everybody that needs a VAT Receipt is making calls and using there Internet for business either there own or for there employers.

Some people are required to have a phone line and internet, so they can be contacted by there employer (receiving calls and e mails). Like people that are on call, eg plumbers, electricians, medical people etc etc, or Reps and PAs. as the phone line and internet is part of their employment some employers kindly pay all or part of the charges. So to claim on expenses the employee needs to provide a valid VAT rec.

You are also assuming that the phone line and internet bills are below £25.This again may not be the case.

Never assume as you can be so wrong sometimes.

If as you say that anybody making calls for or to there employer should be regarded as business use. then why aren't we all on a business tariff, have you never phoned or emailed your employer to let them know something like your ill and not coming in

or for many other reasons ?