topic Re: Phone Line/Fibre Order delays... Why so long! :( in Plusnet Feedback

Phone Line/Fibre Order delays... Why so long! :(

rtmitchell88 — Mon, 20 Jul 2015 07:59:35 GMT

Hello,
Just over six weeks ago I placed my order for plusnet fibre extra, as I was in a new build house I knew this might take longer than normal activations. However now I've been constantly getting texts saying 'phone line order delayed', and most recently about the next time we get in contact we can tell you how much external work needs to be carried out and how long this may potentially be.
How long does this normally take?
For every single update I have contacted plusnet, not the other way round. And most recently when I did call them up for an update, after it the agent had CANCELLED MY ORDER! No idea how he managed to do that when all I said was, please can you update me next week on the changes.
Argh!!!
Spent another hour on the phone to another agent trying to rectify it, thought I'd at least get some compensation for the mess up but no... But they managed to amalgamate my new order to my old order. So fingers crossed it won't affect the amount of work openreach have already done.
But I just want this to be over now... It's so frustrating not having internet . Why can't you get openreach to pull there finger out. I don't want to be waiting 6month for broadband :(.
Help!?

Re: Phone Line/Fibre Order delays... Why so long! :(

Townman — Mon, 20 Jul 2015 09:04:54 GMT

Hi,
A warm welcome to the forums. New builds and non-served premises are all too often problematic. BTOR are a complete mess, accountable to no one and it appears no one can influence their performance - see here - http://community.plus.net/forum/index.php/topic,139693.0.html
Installing new infrastructure appears to be problematic. In the case of new builds phone lines seem to be treated as an optional utility, unlike gas and power which the builder is obliged to 'lay on' as part of the build. All too often the local access network (d-side) circuits are added as an after thought. Even where they have been installed as part of the build, BTOR's provision of exchange side circuits (e-side) and capacity lags demand.
In such cases BTOR do cancel orders so that their provisioning stats do not look quite so bad in their performance reports to Ofcom. It's called cooking the books.
You need to ask PlusNET what is the specific reason for the delayed provision: d-side circuit - wires (BTOR responsibility) or ducts (usually builder's responsibility); cabinet capacity; e-side circuits or exchange capacity.
In some areas new subscribers are having to wait for another subscriber to cease service to free up an e-side circuit. In such situations a firm prod with a very sharp stick has resulted in BTOR getting their records updated and available lines being 'found'.
Direct complaints to other CEOs within the BT group can also be effective.

Re: Phone Line/Fibre Order delays... Why so long! :(

MattyC — Mon, 20 Jul 2015 12:01:12 GMT

Hi rmitchell88,
Welcome to the forums, sorry that it's under poor circumstances.

Quote from: rtmitchell88
Spent another hour on the phone to another agent trying to rectify it, thought I'd at least get some compensation for the mess up but no... But they managed to amalgamate my new order to my old order. So fingers crossed it won't affect the amount of work openreach have already done.

I actually did that myself after speaking with you on Twitter. This is clerical and genuinely hasn't jeopardised the time it should take to get you up and running. I understand that you have spoke with someone in provisioning today, and we've advised that there's a blocked duct in the build up to your property. I have to set expectations accordingly and say that whilst we'll keep chasing, it could be a good length of time before the issue is resolved.
Feel free to keep us updated on the status of your order, and hopefully it's resolved sooner than the advised date.
Matty

Re: Phone Line/Fibre Order delays... Why so long! :(

rtmitchell88 — Tue, 28 Jul 2015 22:01:31 GMT

Just an update on matters. Had a phone call as Matty said from Plusnet a couple of weeks back stating that that Openreacg has given an estimate of August 18th to have my matter resolved.... There's crossed.
However yesterday a utility company dug up the corner of the road where the duct was blocked, but had in fact cracked... They've now put in another one and now hopefully things might kick back into action.
Nearly been three month without wifi... How did they cope in the older days eh!

Re: Phone Line/Fibre Order delays... Why so long! :(

MattyC — Wed, 29 Jul 2015 08:37:59 GMT

That's good news, sounds like progress.
Just out of interest, any idea what the name of the utility company was?
Matty

Re: Phone Line/Fibre Order delays... Why so long! :(

rtmitchell88 — Wed, 29 Jul 2015 09:24:21 GMT

I think it was Aptus Utilities who's fault I think it was for the cracked piping in our development.
Also I think I'm due an update tomorrow on the order, so hopefully I'll find out if this is a tiny or big step towards finally enjoying my broadband.
Ross

Re: Phone Line/Fibre Order delays... Why so long! :(

2u2me — Wed, 29 Jul 2015 09:31:17 GMT

Quote from: Townman
Hi,
A warm welcome to the forums. New builds and non-served premises are all too often problematic. BTOR are a complete mess, accountable to no one and it appears no one can influence their performance - see here - http://community.plus.net/forum/index.php/topic,139693.0.html
Installing new infrastructure appears to be problematic. In the case of new builds phone lines seem to be treated as an optional utility, unlike gas and power which the builder is obliged to 'lay on' as part of the build. All too often the local access network (d-side) circuits are added as an after thought. Even where they have been installed as part of the build, BTOR's provision of exchange side circuits (e-side) and capacity lags demand.
In such cases BTOR do cancel orders so that their provisioning stats do not look quite so bad in their performance reports to Ofcom. It's called cooking the books.
You need to ask PlusNET what is the specific reason for the delayed provision: d-side circuit - wires (BTOR responsibility) or ducts (usually builder's responsibility); cabinet capacity; e-side circuits or exchange capacity.
In some areas new subscribers are having to wait for another subscriber to cease service to free up an e-side circuit. In such situations a firm prod with a very sharp stick has resulted in BTOR getting their records updated and available lines being 'found'.
Direct complaints to other CEOs within the BT group can also be effective.

That is spot on and sums it just about up Townman
I worked for them for over 20 years and turned up many a time to a new build appointment to install a line knowing it was impossible to complete the job as there had been no provision/ plant installed, the only way you could provide it is if a pole DP was near with some spare routing and you had to physically install it all the way back to the exchange including the MDF jumpering and then ring routing and records so they could update the routing, it all took time and that's why other appointments are missed, the other utilities just connect to a main, where telecoms require a individual route all the way back to the exchange,(before broadband it was a little easier you could share 2 lines using wb900 or dacs as this did not affect voice, but it still took extra time and was frustrating to the engineer because he knew appiontments would backup and the control would be ringing him to see why he was taking so long!)

Re: Phone Line/Fibre Order delays... Why so long! :(

rtmitchell88 — Thu, 30 Jul 2015 16:45:22 GMT

So today I was supposed to be updated on my current order but not heard anything yet ands it's 5:45pm so probably not happening.
I thought now my order is with the escalations team they would inform me a bit more urgently, if Matty is looking can you tell link:csa removed to update me please as he is the one dealing with my order.
Ross
adie:red csa removed as per link:rules

Re: Phone Line/Fibre Order delays... Why so long! :(

Townman — Thu, 30 Jul 2015 21:56:29 GMT

The BT OPENREACH escalations team is over stretched at the moment...

Re: Phone Line/Fibre Order delays... Why so long! :(

rtmitchell88 — Fri, 31 Jul 2015 10:34:36 GMT

I'm talking about PLUSNET here...

Re: Phone Line/Fibre Order delays... Why so long! :(

Townman — Fri, 31 Jul 2015 11:30:20 GMT

I understood that, however where does PlusNET esclations team esclate to? BT Openreach's esclations team ... who at present are on something like a 1 week turnaround.

Re: Phone Line/Fibre Order delays... Why so long! :(

adamwalker — Mon, 03 Aug 2015 08:20:33 GMT

Hi rtmitchell88,
I've just checked our suppliers systems and no updates are showing there meaning we need to give them a call.
FYI Mark doesn't have personal ownership of your query but the supplier team will be chasing this up soon for you.
Adam

Re: Phone Line/Fibre Order delays... Why so long! :(

rtmitchell88 — Wed, 05 Aug 2015 09:41:26 GMT

Hi Adam,
Well if your could that would be appreciated, I mentioned Mark just because everyone who I've spoke to at plusnet has given me different opinions but he was the one that actually said to me he would keep an eye on it, as it was now escalated.
The latest I am being told now as the entire street is now waiting to be activated by BT Openreach is that the developers have said there finished with all here work, but OR says it's not fully competed. And with this its horrifically hard for OR and the developers to have a simple conversation.
Also the problem is also there are two separate teams it seems, and ours is with new sites which seems to take a slow pace for responses.
I can see on roadworks.org that BT are installing 30m of poly duct near me, but I have no idea if this is to serve us.
How long could this take! It's depressing.

Re: Phone Line/Fibre Order delays... Why so long! :(

HarryB — Wed, 05 Aug 2015 12:15:01 GMT

The information you've found on roadworks.org seems to match up with our most recent update from our suppliers yesterday as it advises the work will be ongoing until 18/08/15.
Here are the notes from the Opennreach order tracker yesterday, following a call to them.

Quote
The order is with Lineplant Works Team on activity 10 for cable and jointing work. Latest update is: ECD (Estimated Completion Date): 18/08 . Please continue to monitor this activity on Order Tracker for updates and next review Order Tracker on 19/08/2015 .

I am sorry this is taking so long and I hope we can give you some better news on 19/08/15.

Re: Phone Line/Fibre Order delays... Why so long! :(

rtmitchell88 — Thu, 13 Aug 2015 09:12:12 GMT

So it seems are looking a bit better now nearly 3 months since I started my order...However I am getting my information now from my next door neighbour who is also going through the same problem as me.
Yesterday Openreach were "pumping" the lines through to the houses after the duct was successfully unblocked.
Once these become active how long does it normally take to get fibre sorted, do I have to wait for another engineer appointment to sort the openreach modem out?? If so that could be another 2 week wait just for that... sigh
Fingers crossed were into the final straight, i'll keep you posted. However it seems im getting more information from my next door neighbour rather than the escalations dept.

Re: Phone Line/Fibre Order delays... Why so long! :(

Townman — Fri, 14 Aug 2015 07:10:27 GMT

Would be interesting to know from where your neighbour is getting their information. From my own experience, BTOR escalations (DSO) are disclosing very little information to plusnet, in spite of the high level of esclations on my case (only impacting me). That makes me wonder if your neighbour knows someone who works for BTOR in your locality. BTOR people on the ground will know much more about what is happening than the BTOR problem management teams.

Re: Phone Line/Fibre Order delays... Why so long! :(

rtmitchell88 — Fri, 14 Aug 2015 12:31:54 GMT

Hey Townman,
My neighbour is getting his phoneline/fibre with BT and is getting a daily phonecall from their escalations department to update him, so whenever he hears from them he feeds the info to me.
I'd love that kind of service due to the fact we are waiting for a considerable amount of time now.

Re: Phone Line/Fibre Order delays... Why so long! :(

Townman — Sun, 16 Aug 2015 09:44:09 GMT

Quote from: HarryB
The information you've found on roadworks.org seems to match up with our most recent update from our suppliers yesterday as it advises the work will be ongoing until 18/08/15.

Quote from: rtmitchell88
My neighbour is getting his phoneline/fibre with BT and is getting a daily phonecall from their escalations department to update him

@CRT,
This has all the hallmarks of BTOR keeping BT Retail advised of progress on a daily basis, whilst plusnet is getting fobbed off with inadequate weekly deferrals of updates. Am I guilty of being cynical or is there a ring of truth in these unpalatable observations?
...or is it simply a matter that BT Retail has more staff "wasting time" chasing BTOR service delivery failures than Plusnet has available to do the same? If only there were some means of making BTOR more accountable, everyone's efforts would be more productive and less stressful.
Kevin

Re: Phone Line/Fibre Order delays... Why so long! :(

AndyH — Sun, 16 Aug 2015 09:58:09 GMT

Quote from: Townman
This has all the hallmarks of BTOR keeping BT Retail advised of progress on a daily basis, whilst plusnet is getting fobbed off with inadequate weekly deferrals of updates. Am I guilty of being cynical or is there a ring of truth in these unpalatable observations?

Not really - it's just BT Retail have better systems and processes to keep customers informed. They have exactly the same information any other ISP has. The problem with Plusnet is that if you don't ask, you don't get - you need to press to be kept up-to-date on what is going on.
The delay in the OP getting the line/fibre seems to be down to the fact the delay in the work being done by the developers to a satisfactory standard with it being signed off by Openreach.

Re: Phone Line/Fibre Order delays... Why so long! :(

Townman — Sun, 16 Aug 2015 12:19:48 GMT

Hi Andy,
We might guess that anything is possible, but an answer (if permissible) from CRT would be useful. Harry's comment rather matches my own experience: the information available to PlusNET on protracted BTOR issues only seems to get updated weekly. The OP somewhat implies that BT Retail has access to daily changes in status, from which they can provide daily reports of progress to their subscribers.
Personally I have given up chasing daily, because BTOR are (as ever) dragging their feet, not moving the issue forward and providing infrequent updates to PlusNET. Whilst I understand your sentiments about keeping people informed, I equally see operational benefits in not reporting no change in status so that those resources can remain focussed on chasing esclations until there is progress to be reported.
It is a difficult paradigm within which to operate - a single supplier for which there is no alternative, refusing to progress issues in a timely manner, who week after week report "no progress". PlusNET seem to be worrking with BTOR "next update will be in N days time", advising users of that and then "parking" tickets for review at the appointed BTOR update time.
If BT Retail does have access to additional information which is also available to other iSPs but is not being used by PlusNET, then I would like to know exactly what that information is, which systems it is in, so that PlusNET can be challenged over not using it. In the meantime, I am not dissuaded from my belief that BTOR is providing a preferential level of service to BT Retail compared to that given to non-LLU retailers.
Cheers,
Kevin