topic Re: OFCOM new market classification scheme in Plusnet Feedback

OFCOM new market classification scheme

x47c — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 07:37:55 GMT

Well I'm sure you will all like to discuss this proposal/consultation.
http://stakeholders.ofcom.org.uk/consultations/review-wba-markets/
As outlined by ispreview
http://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2013/07/ofcom-force-bt-to-cut-uk-wholesale-standard-broadband-isp-prices.html
Small changes in prices MIGHT be possible if ISP pass them on.
Market classification scheme changed so exchanges become market A or market B

Re: OFCOM new market classification scheme

Anonymous — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 08:29:22 GMT

So even Ofcom has noticed that Plusnet "charge customers significantly more if they live within a Market 1"
[quote=from above article from ISPreview]This is important because some BT based ISPs, such as PlusNet, can charge customers significantly more if they live within a Market 1 (soon to be Market A) area because they cost more to serve, while most others will spread the costs via a standard price. Separately both TalkTalk and Sky Broadband charge more if you live in an area where their own unbundled lines have yet to reach.

Re: OFCOM new market classification scheme

Anonymous — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 08:47:19 GMT

There were also a couple of documents Ofcom published last week regarding broadband markets -
http://consumers.ofcom.org.uk/2013/07/new-measures-to-boost-superfast-broadband-competition/
http://stakeholders.ofcom.org.uk/consultations/fixed-access-market-reviews/

Re: OFCOM new market classification scheme

RichardB — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 08:49:48 GMT

Quote from: purleigh
So even Ofcom has noticed that Plusnet "charge customers significantly more if they live within a Market 1"

I think the PlusNet reference came from the ispreview article. I can find no reference to PlusNet's charging policy in the OFCOM document.
Richard

Re: OFCOM new market classification scheme

Oldjim — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 09:08:09 GMT

Looking at the base figures about 90% of premises will be in Market B
So taking the Plusnet present figures for unlimited broadband where you take the phone
Market A £16.99
Market B £9.99
Average charge per connection is £10.69 although given that Market A potential customers would probably go with BT for £16 per month the proportion on a Market A exchange will likely be much lower.
It would appear to me that the Plusnet marketing policy is to aim for the lowest headline cost with the 10% of potential customers who wouldn't get it going elsewhere.
I suspect that this is a very successful policy as it allows a degree of competition against the LLU suppliers
EDIT - as was pointed out a bit further down the new Market A includes all exchanges presently classified as Market 1 and 2 which rather mucks up the above price assumptions
EDIT first line corrected - thanks Kelly

Re: OFCOM new market classification scheme

Anonymous — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 09:15:01 GMT

Replying to RichardB, I agree those words appear to be ISPreview's translation of the Ofcom statement (amongst others) -
[quote=Ofcom article]6.70 : Historically, BT has priced its main products uniformly at the retail level. However, there is no assurance that it will continue this practice. It already prices some of its business products differentially according to geographic areas. Moreover, the BT subsidiary Plus.net prices differently in Market 2 and Market 3 (compared with Market 1).

Re: OFCOM new market classification scheme

x47c — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 09:24:08 GMT

Current market 2 exchange customers might be "feeling sick as a parrot" when they realise they are going to be lumped in with Market 1 customers in the new pricing structure.
(I think there are around 600 to 700 market 2 exchanges)

Re: OFCOM new market classification scheme

Kelly — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 09:25:53 GMT

Quote from: Oldjim
Looking at the base figures about 90% of premises will be in Market A

Am I being thick? Or should that be Market B?

Re: OFCOM new market classification scheme

Oldjim — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 09:33:04 GMT

whoops - corrected

Re: OFCOM new market classification scheme

colintivy — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 09:56:37 GMT

The Ofcom remarks re BTO performance are very welcome. Looking at the posts on this forum which seem to largely about their lack of customer service. I also wonder what the likely out come of the Market 1 and Market 2 into Market B will be for a customer like me with 20CN at an exchange with DLM which is overactive, connected by 1 KM of overhead lines of doubtful antiquity will be?

Re: OFCOM new market classification scheme

RichardB — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 09:57:33 GMT

Quote from: x47c
Current market 2 exchange customers might be "feeling sick as a parrot" when they realise they are going to be lumped in with Market 1 customers in the new pricing structure.
(I think there are around 600 to 700 market 2 exchanges)

However, a percentage of the current Market 2 exchanges are only Market 2 because they serve less than 10,000 premises.
I cannot see this limit in the WBA consultation document.
In addition, a number of Market 2 exchanges had only 1 or 2 wholesale broadband providers when last reviewed, now have 3 or more wholesale broadband providers.
These two changes give me hope that my Market two exchange will be reclassified as Market B.

Re: OFCOM new market classification scheme

x47c — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 10:38:30 GMT

Good points @RichardB - I'd forgotten there were other factors as well as merely the number of LLU operators that currently determine what market the exchange is currently classified as. So it's not the case that all market two exchanges will be lumped in together with mkt1.
Edit
Detailed list of exchanges showing which proposed Market they will be in:
On the OFCOM consulation page I linked to in post 1...................
download the PDF of consultation annexes and appendixes
List of Market A and Mkt B exchanges starts on Page 44
you will have to get your exchange Ident code from Samknows site
http://www.samknows.com/broadband/exchange_search

Re: OFCOM new market classification scheme

Mayfly — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 12:06:39 GMT

Sods law - whenever I get close to gaining something they move the goal posts!!
Will be interesting to see what PNs new pricing structure will be for the Mkt A exchanges.

Re: OFCOM new market classification scheme

RichardB — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 14:07:04 GMT

Quote from: x47c
download the PDF of consultation annexes and appendixes
List of Market A and Mkt B exchanges starts on Page 44
you will have to get your exchange Ident code from Samknows site
http://www.samknows.com/broadband/exchange_search

Hooray my exchange is listed as Market B

Re: OFCOM new market classification scheme

Anonymous — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 15:35:23 GMT

D'Oh ! - mine will be "Market A"
The link to that pdf listing which market your exchange will be in is here - http://stakeholders.ofcom.org.uk/binaries/consultations/review-wba-markets/annexes/WBA_July_2013_annexes.pdf

Re: OFCOM new market classification scheme

Mayfly — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 15:39:00 GMT

What are you currently purleigh?

Re: OFCOM new market classification scheme

Anonymous — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 15:47:22 GMT

Currently "Market 1" as it says in my signature field (below) next to the angry face
I wasn't expecting it not to become "Market A" but I will forever live in hope !

Re: OFCOM new market classification scheme

davidj66 — Fri, 12 Jul 2013 08:34:27 GMT

Mine is Market 1 with one current LLU supplier (SKY) and one "planned" by December 2013(TALKTALK) ......but its going to be Market A
God knows what it will mean for future Plusnet pricing,particularly when we get fibre sometime in 2014!!

Re: OFCOM new market classification scheme

colintivy — Fri, 12 Jul 2013 09:04:48 GMT

It looks like I am in the same state as Purleigh, Market 1 to Market A without much sign that there is any updating of such a minor exchange. Rural users are well in the long grass as far as any tangible improvements in service are concerned. I have noticed quite a lot of BTO bottoms visible at manholes round here with the occasional complete disconnections of phone and BB service happening. Synch speed and Noise ratios up and down like a fiddler's elbow as a result.
Not living in any hope I am afraid.

Re: OFCOM new market classification scheme

Anonymous — Fri, 12 Jul 2013 10:23:56 GMT

It REALLY annoys me that in addition to the "Market 1" price premium, that Plusnet introduced the £2.50 per month price penalty for changing to a different broadband only product ! - I don't want their phone service !.
Why couldn't the £2.50 apply just to "new customers", and not to upgraders ?, especially when "new customers" benefit from introductory deals but existing customers don't.
I have been patiently waiting for years for FTTC to arrive, and until recently I was on a legacy product that didn't have market pricing - which seemed fair, but now if FTTC arrives I really can't justify paying £30.99 a month - almost double my monthly ADSL subscription which in itself is already £7 more expensive than other Plusnet customers on the same package but on "Market 2/3" 21CN exchanges with three times the connection speed.
Further to rub salt into the wounds I am stuck going nowhere with eleven months remaining having been locked into a 12 month contract, on an inadequate "up to" 8mbps 20CN ADSL1 connection.