topic Re: a nervous newbie ... in Plusnet Feedback

a nervous newbie ...

WillyWombat — Tue, 21 May 2013 11:00:41 GMT

Hi everyone I'm new on the block, just signed up for PN phone+Fibre so thought I'd call by the community and get a feel for the new gaff while awaiting the migration. Forgive me if opening a new topic isn't the right way to do it. Never done any online forum stuff before but as I'm off work with a broken leg, I thought why not check out PlusNet from their users' p.o.v.? Seemed like a good idea at the time...
Well my trawl through page after page of moans with a mounting sense of dread about the forthcoming migrate became compulsive until I stumbled upon a multi-threaded total epic by a certain 'Devonian' at which point I broke out in a sweat and poured the whiskey.
Reason? The 2 big recurring fails in this apparently fragile ecosystem that is FTTC broadband seem to be BTOR (the famously 'non-client-facing' organisation with whom I've already had a run in) and, you guessed it, TalkTalk - from whom I am migrating after a 6 month durr-fest trying and failing to get upgraded onto their own Fibre service Seems I've been a loyal customer on their LLU for so long my postcode and phone number details have fallen off of the BTOR database such that TT themselves can no longer raise an order to get me onto fibre, which I'm guessing isn't part of their LLU in my exchange (or any for all I know). For months I have not even been able to leave TT, because no other ISP could see my address on their postcode lookup.
Must have eventually updated somehow because when I tried the PlusNet sign-up process last week for about the hundredth time, it suddenly unlocked and allowed me to proceed to order - even tho TT's own system still can't! Didn't waste any time bunging my order in, but now I'm worried - I've read that migrating off an LLU ISP back to a BTw dependent service necessitates a new phone number which is a total no-no for us, - although no mention of this when I went thru the PN ordering sequence. Any kb on this anyone?
Fortunately the other key lesson to come out of my forum surfing is that PN customer support seems to be legendary so on that I will depend. Everything's crossed for the next 3 weeks (uncomfortable though that is becoming ) that this migrate isn't going to turn into a whole bag of hurt. Shame really because to be fair to TT all was sweet with their phone /ADSL for years until I had the temerity to request the fibre upgrade.
Anyway great to be joining a provider based in my old home town of Sheffield, not 7000 miles away and reading off a script (which I now know off by heart....)
WW

Re: a nervous newbie ...

kdoug007 — Tue, 21 May 2013 12:00:38 GMT

well i dont have the " fibre route" but more than happy with the standard way..
great to hear ya with PN. terrific service

Re: a nervous newbie ...

orbrey — Tue, 21 May 2013 12:35:11 GMT

Hi WillyWombat,
Welcome to the forums, and thanks very much
Unfortunately though I don't have any good news about the order. It looks like our suppliers can't find the active line at your property, I assume therefore it's an LLU line and fully in control of TalkTalk (which may be why they are unable to provide fibre, though it'd have been a fairly easy change to swap that over to the BT platform - could be wrong on that one though).
This means that we can't take over the existing line or keep the number I'm afraid. We need to install a new phone line (which will come with a new number) and if you're happy to go ahead with this should be able to arrange for the fibre to be provided simultaneously with this.
Really sorry we couldn't keep your existing line and number though, please advise if you'd still like to go ahead with the order and we'll get things moving for you.

Re: a nervous newbie ...

deathtrap — Tue, 21 May 2013 13:21:25 GMT

When you in the past input your address or post code details into various ISP availability checkers ,did you also input your address and post code into this BT wholesale checker https://www.btwholesale.com/includes/adsl/main.html As it should tell you based on your address & post code what the speed estimates are for you line as well as the FTTC availability and which cabinet number your line is connected to, this will also help confirm what is available to you,
As for TALK TALK and migrating away from them, on FULL LLU you firstly have to cancel your telephone service with TT this will trigger a cease of the line, then you need to find a supplier like who can take over the line and hopefully port your existing number too, BT can do this, and don't charge, but they tie you into a min term of 12mths calling plan , the post office may do a short term line rental contract , Then once your line returns to a standard WLR3 line on the BT data base you can order xDSL from any ISP,
I'm surprised plusnet can't do a return to donor order , and then once the line is transferred they could order FTTC , But as i said i'm fairly sure that you would have to cancel the TT first , or such an order would fail But there is no proper regulation in place for migration to and from Full LLU AKA Sky /TT

Re: a nervous newbie ...

kevyandrean — Tue, 21 May 2013 13:23:29 GMT

Quote from: WillyWombat
Hi everyone I'm new on the block, just signed up for PN phone+Fibre so thought I'd call by the community and get a feel for the new gaff while awaiting the migration. Forgive me if opening a new topic isn't the right way to do it. Never done any online forum stuff before but as I'm off work with a broken leg, I thought why not check out PlusNet from their users' p.o.v.? Seemed like a good idea at the time...
Well my trawl through page after page of moans with a mounting sense of dread about the forthcoming migrate became compulsive until I stumbled upon a multi-threaded total epic by a certain 'Devonian' at which point I broke out in a sweat and poured the whiskey.
Reason? The 2 big recurring fails in this apparently fragile ecosystem that is FTTC broadband seem to be BTOR (the famously 'non-client-facing' organisation with whom I've already had a run in) and, you guessed it, TalkTalk - from whom I am migrating after a 6 month durr-fest trying and failing to get upgraded onto their own Fibre service Seems I've been a loyal customer on their LLU for so long my postcode and phone number details have fallen off of the BTOR database such that TT themselves can no longer raise an order to get me onto fibre, which I'm guessing isn't part of their LLU in my exchange (or any for all I know). For months I have not even been able to leave TT, because no other ISP could see my address on their postcode lookup.
Must have eventually updated somehow because when I tried the PlusNet sign-up process last week for about the hundredth time, it suddenly unlocked and allowed me to proceed to order - even tho TT's own system still can't! Didn't waste any time bunging my order in, but now I'm worried - I've read that migrating off an LLU ISP back to a BTw dependent service necessitates a new phone number which is a total no-no for us, - although no mention of this when I went thru the PN ordering sequence. Any kb on this anyone?
Fortunately the other key lesson to come out of my forum surfing is that PN customer support seems to be legendary so on that I will depend. Everything's crossed for the next 3 weeks (uncomfortable though that is becoming ) that this migrate isn't going to turn into a whole bag of hurt. Shame really because to be fair to TT all was sweet with their phone /ADSL for years until I had the temerity to request the fibre upgrade.
Anyway great to be joining a provider based in my old home town of Sheffield, not 7000 miles away and reading off a script (which I now know off by heart....)
WW

like you im new to PN. through the years iv been about abit and im finding them some what a refreshing experience. Tlk talk on the other-hand shouldn't be in business the way they treat people. that company is a disgrace and nothing less.

Re: a nervous newbie ...

MisterW — Tue, 21 May 2013 13:39:43 GMT

Quote
As for TALK TALK and migrating away from them, on FULL LLU you firstly have to cancel your telephone service with TT this will trigger a cease of the line, then you need to find a supplier like who can take over the line and hopefully port your existing number too

Not true, it's normally possible to transfer from TT LLU without any problem, a colleague of mine has done just that to PlusNet Fibre. What seems to be the issue here is that the phone number is no longer on the Btw database and so they ( well their system anyway! ) can't find the line, so what!. The line IS still on BTORs database though ( with its circuit id ), it must be, they still maintain it!. All that's needed is the ability for BTw to get the circuit id from TT and I guess that's the piece of the jigsaw that's missing. It's crazy , somebody ( but I guess we're talking Ofcom here so that won't happen! ) needs to bang some heads together and get systems in place that are fit for purpose.

Re: a nervous newbie ...

RJM — Tue, 21 May 2013 14:10:33 GMT

I transferred from Sky LLU to Plusnet with no problem.

Re: a nervous newbie ...

WillyWombat — Tue, 21 May 2013 14:34:54 GMT

Oh dear. Oh dear. What have I done. Thanks all for your ... erm ... welcome. I should have been more cautious when the PN sign up page opened unexpectedly.
kevyandrean yeah I already been reading about your trials, part of what was making me nervous, hope your issues are soon sorted.
Matt @Plusnet, thanks for update, BUT, well my order has been parked on your system since 9th May, (along with 150 quid), tell me if I hadn't posted on a whim would I have been waiting in on 6th June joyously expecting my BTOR engineer and blissfully unaware of all the background complexity, or would someone from PN eventually have notified me of the issue before then? I have been tracking the order which has been saying 'we are running some checks on your line' since 9th May, shouldn't a showstopper like this have come up early on? We can't contemplate a number change, looks like I am going to have to try some kind of Dr Who warp trick to migrate via BT. I don't want to be with BT and I *really* don't want to be with TT a moment longer
@deathtrap .... Blimey O'reilly. Is it *really* this complicated? Am I really in TT's stranglehold? The BT wholesale checker reports: "There is no data available for this number. This could be either because it is not a BT line or it is a new BT number that has just been provided. Most new numbers will appear on the checker 24 hours after BT has installed the line". They're right, obviously its not a BT line but I have had an active line + ADSL here for > 10 years.
Seems my anxieties were well placed ... WW

Re: a nervous newbie ...

James — Tue, 21 May 2013 14:36:21 GMT

Quote
@deathtrap .... Blimey O'reilly. Is it *really* this complicated? Am I really in TT's stranglehold? The BT wholesale checker reports: "There is no data available for this number. This could be either because it is not a BT line or it is a new BT number that has just been provided. Most new numbers will appear on the checker 24 hours after BT has installed the line". They're right, obviously its not a BT line but I have had an active line + ADSL here for > 10 years.

That just means that the number isn't in BTs network. If you are a TalkTalk customer it is exactly what you should expect to see.

Re: a nervous newbie ...

MisterW — Tue, 21 May 2013 14:40:15 GMT

Quote
looks like I am going to have to try some kind of Dr Who warp trick to migrate via BT. I don't want to be with BT and I *really* don't want to be with TT a moment longer

I don't think it will make any difference, if BT(Retail) can migrate the line then PlusNet can, they both use BTw.

Re: a nervous newbie ...

tijara33 — Tue, 21 May 2013 15:03:56 GMT

My sympathies. I quit Talk Talk/AOL to come to PN, albeit direct from the exchange without any LLU rubbish. TalkTalk really are the most incompetent company around. They're so bad they make BT look good.
My service from PN has been excellent, I hope that you manage to get sorted out.

Re: a nervous newbie ...

deathtrap — Tue, 21 May 2013 17:43:01 GMT

Quote from: WillyWombat

@deathtrap .... Blimey O'reilly. Is it *really* this complicated? Am I really in TT's stranglehold? The BT wholesale checker reports: "There is no data available for this number. This could be either because it is not a BT line or it is a new BT number that has just been provided. Most new numbers will appear on the checker 24 hours after BT has installed the line". They're right, obviously it's not a BT line but I have had an active line + ADSL here for > 10 years.[quote/]
Seems my anxieties were well placed ...

Yes as James has said, if you only enter your telephone number the your address and post code instead of your number the BT Wholesale checker will spit out a generic report of no data ect, Which is why i asked if you had input details of your address and post code in to the checker , it would/should then give an estimated speed for that address along with exchange & cabinet number as well as what ( WBC 20CN /21CN & FTTC )Products are available to you, But it would appear that you chose to ignore that suggestion and input you number instead

then you will see where to input address details
Just to be clear , only trying to help out
As for the other stuff yes it can be and often is problematic migrating away from FULL LLU (SKY & TT) partly because to date there is no system/legislation in place , where as with SMPF partial LLU or WBC based products the MAC code system protects consumers to some degree , it's one of the disadvantages of being Fully unbundled I'm afraid

Re: a nervous newbie ...

slooowwwlllyyy — Wed, 22 May 2013 00:41:50 GMT

Be afraid be very very afraid
Just to report that with going with plusnet which is owned by BT you will get the same service as BT

Quote from: tijara33
My sympathies. I quit Talk Talk/AOL to come to PN, albeit direct from the exchange without any LLU rubbish. TalkTalk really are the most incompetent company around. They're so bad they make BT look good.
My service from PN has been excellent, I hope that you manage to get sorted out.

wait untill till you try plusnet which is part off BT you will be Begging talk talk tpo take you back

Re: a nervous newbie ...

slooowwwlllyyy — Wed, 22 May 2013 00:46:53 GMT

It only took me 35 minutes to post the last post , i suppose that is not to bad by plusnet standards is it ?

Re: a nervous newbie ...

orbrey — Wed, 22 May 2013 08:25:24 GMT

Hi slowly,
Sorry to hear you have a line fault, I'm guessing it's the same whether you use the connection wirelessly or with a network cable plugged in between router and PC?

Re: a nervous newbie ...

orbrey — Wed, 22 May 2013 08:31:20 GMT

Hi WillyWombat,
I picked up the message from a ticket on your account, I believe this should have been emailed to you? If not it's viewable at http://contactus.plus.net. That being said you should have received an email or a call either way and I'll be feeding back if that was the case or not.

where do i stand?????

kevyandrean — Wed, 22 May 2013 10:47:44 GMT

The 10th of may i signed up with plusnet and im still not connected after promise after promise. Now they have decided i need a new line as talk talk are being awkward. Plusnet should of been aware of the situation well before now and installed the line weeks ago. like iv said before this service is so in portent to some people, it is there life and through no choice of there own. I was full of enthusiasm for joining this provider but thats changed to total disappointment. Plusnet seem so slow about everything, more so than any other provider iv been with over the years. Its as if sometimes they need a firework up their bum.
I am physically and emotionally drained, im on the floor and have had to sign my partner who i love with all my heart into temporary care for a month starting friday . see he's brain damaged from an injury in Afghanistan. the INTERNET and phone is his life. i feel i have failed him and it hurts badly. I was promised by talk talk ill be live untill changeover and steps had been taken to ensure its as smooth s can be because of my situation. Talk talk are now blaming plusnet for "not doing their job properly"
It may sound petty to you people but im heartbroken. I really thought plusnet was the one we could be with for many years.
Where do i stand about getting my £33 back?

Re: where do i stand?????

chrispurvey — Wed, 22 May 2013 10:51:57 GMT

I've replied to your other thread.

Re: a nervous newbie ...

WillyWombat — Wed, 22 May 2013 13:59:02 GMT

Ok thanks for bearing with me Deathtrap. I'm learning a new language here. My retail experience in life has generally been along the lines of: 1) choose a product; 2) pay for it; 3) take it home and use it. I've stumbled upon a whole virtual world here which may end up too taxing for my small brain.
Anyway, following your very clear guidance this time gives me "Your address has been successfully matched; however we cannot determine ADSL availability at this address. Please try the Telephone Number or Postcode Checker", surprise surprise.
Checking on just Postcode alone option (without full address details) gives:
(Sorry couldn't paste image, I've attached screenshot)
Available Products
Downstream Line Rate(Mbps)
Upstream Line Rate(Mbps)
Downstream Range(Mbps)
Availability Date
Featured Products
WBC ADSL 2+ Up to 3 -- 2.5 to 6.5 Available
ADSL Max Up to 3 -- 2 to 5.5 Available
WBC Fixed Rate 1 -- -- Available
Fixed Rate 1 -- -- Available
For all ADSL and WBC Fibre to the Cabinet (FTTC) services, the stable line rate will be determined during the first 10 days of service usage. Throughput/download speeds will be less than line rates and can be affected by a number of factors within and external to BT's network, Communication Providers' networks and within customer premises.
The Stop Sale date for Datastream is from 30-Jun-2012; the Formal Retirement date for Datastream is from 31-Mar-2014. The Stop Sale date for IPstream is from 31-Oct-2013; the Formal Retirement date for IPstream is from 31-Mar-2014.
Note: Please note that postcode and address check results are indicative only. Most accurate results can be obtained from a telephone number check.

It does offer the option of a 'NAD' search requiring a NAD key and district i.d., but I don't know what this is.

Matt Taylor @plusnet: thank you for your response. No I have not received any emails or tickets, that's why I was sitting tight waiting for D-Day until I called by here on a whim yesterday. I don't want to check out on day one of this journey but I guess I am going to have to chase this formally through TT to cease their product and get 'released' back to BTw in the first instance. In which case a return of the £153 upfront payment would be appropriate as would the hope that I will happen along again as a PN customer once I've disentangled. We can't change our number, not after 15 years.
I've discovered there are many more layers to this than I appreciated when I clicked on 'Proceed'. Were it not for the incredibly positive attitude of this forum towards PN I may not have been so inclined to go round the circuit again but I'm keen to get here one way or another. You must be grateful for your loyal customer base.
Thanks all WW

Re: a nervous newbie ...

deathtrap — Wed, 22 May 2013 15:24:30 GMT

On the face of it, from the info the BT wholesale availability checker spat out,for your post code, it would appear that FTTC isn't available as it is not one of the listed services available no mention of WBC FTTC with a speed estimate,
But interestingly if i do a search by post code although the results are showing FTTC and est speed it does incorrectly show FTTC being available from March 14, when it's been available since the beginning of the year on the cab i am connected to, and my post code only covers the street i live in the most reliable results are in a lot of cases from the address search option , as for a NAD key and district ID , i have no idea what these are either,lol
I would imagine that all ISP's would have access to more reliable info,than the BTW checker regarding your line , there is another checker for FTTC that may or may not help you find out if it's available or not http://www.superfast-openreach.co.uk/where-and-when/ Just input your post code , But even this isn't always 100% accurate