topic Re: Plusnet, You have duped me.. in Plusnet Feedback

Plusnet, You have duped me..

ronroam1 — Fri, 19 Feb 2010 00:06:09 GMT

There I was, ten year subscriber to AOL and, sure, I've had problems with them but hell, when it worked it worked well. I consistently got over 2MB download.
Now, after about 10 days, the promised 2mb from Plusnet is a fiction of their imagination. My Broadband Speed has clocked between 740kb and 1.7mb max.
The service call time when I last tried calling was 10 minutes according to their message but the statistics gave the waiting time at about 1 minute!
Sorry Plusnet but it seems you've exceeded your resources and cannot cope with demand.
Now I want to get out. Do I really have to pay the 'deferred' charges of £40 for the router and £40 for set up charges plus remainder of contract charges?
Plusnet you know you are in trouble and cannot deliver ; are cancellation charges now your extra income or can I go quietly?

Re: Plusnet, You have duped me..

bobpullen — Fri, 19 Feb 2010 00:31:39 GMT

Sorry to hear you're less than satisfied
You wouldn't have to pay for a year's subscription charges if you left but you would need to pay for the router and the deferred setup fees. Have you raised a support ticket about your speed problems yet? We'd like to be given the opportunity to resolve any problems you might have before you make the decision as to whether or not you want to leave?

Re: Plusnet, You have duped me..

ronroam1 — Fri, 19 Feb 2010 00:48:11 GMT

Bob, thanks for your reply.
The answer to your question is no but I have just now raised a ticket and the response time is given as 19 hours plus.
Regarding your statement that I must still effectively have to pay £80 despite Plusnet not meeting its promised 2mb speed delivery : firstly, if you cannot fulfill your promised 2mb are you not in default and, secondly, most contracts have a 14 day 'no fee, cancellation' period.
Thirdly, if I am outside any shorter period, say 7 days, then that is because I was told by your advisors to wait 10 days for the line to stabilize before doing anything else.
Your response is welcomed.

Re: Plusnet, You have duped me..

bobpullen — Fri, 19 Feb 2010 10:12:33 GMT

Quote from: ronroam1
Bob, thanks for your reply.
The answer to your question is no but I have just now raised a ticket and the response time is given as 19 hours plus.

I'll try and take a look a little later on for you (off to a meeting v.shortly).

Quote
Regarding your statement that I must still effectively have to pay £80 despite Plusnet not meeting its promised 2mb speed delivery : firstly, if you cannot fulfill your promised 2mb are you not in default and, secondly, most contracts have a 14 day 'no fee, cancellation' period.

Where have we promised you 2Mbps? Any speed quoted to you should be an estimate and not a guarantee. Due to the nature of DSL technology it's simply not practical nor possible to offer a solid guarantee regarding the speeds you'll receive. You're entitled to cancel within the 14 days but as we've incurred costs from our wholesalers to provision your line you're expected to cover them. Bear in mind that the contract you agreed to will have effectively started when you signed up and not when the service was provisioned. I'm no legal expert but we've been doing this long enough now or me to know that we're not doing anything wrong.

Quote
Thirdly, if I am outside any shorter period, say 7 days, then that is because I was told by your advisors to wait 10 days for the line to stabilize before doing anything else.
Your response is welcomed.

I think what I've said above covers this too.
I'll update this thread once I've had the chance to look over your account...

Re: Plusnet, You have duped me..

ronroam1 — Fri, 19 Feb 2010 17:15:29 GMT

Hi Bob,
Well, today has been interesting. I called the Which legal team who told me that the effective 'cooling off' period is still on-going because no cancellation charges were presented to me in a 'durable' form, ie by email or letter. However, your cancellations people very politely told me that the arrangement of having a direct link provided to the T&Cs from my account screen was, apparently, acceptable to the OFT.
Seems I am stuffed and will have to pay £80 to break free.
The other interesting thing is that when I spoke to your Cancellation department they told me that the local system that AOL provides compared to PN is different. The PN system provided by BT is susceptible to noise issues and BT can reduce the BB speed to stabilise the line. This could explain the AOL speed of 2MB speed - and other providers higher speeds in this area - compared with PN at 0.7MB.
I've agreed with your cancellations people that I will try plugging directly into the main BT socket (after unscrewing the cover) to eliminate noise as the issue and they will call me on Tuesday for us to finalise this.

Re: Plusnet, You have duped me..

Chris — Fri, 19 Feb 2010 17:21:35 GMT

If you were on LLU with AOL, that would explain the difference in the way the line profiling is managed.
Once you're connected to the master socket, take a look at the routerstats and see what the downstream connection rate is showing, if this is an increase on 1600 then leave it there and the IP profile will increase after 3 days and you'll start to see higher speeds.
The router ideally should be situated close to the master socket as this is the point where the broadband service first comes into the premises and is required for any faults testing.

Re: Plusnet, You have duped me..

ronroam1 — Fri, 19 Feb 2010 17:59:14 GMT

Chris,
I did as you said and the bandwidth before plugging directly into the main line was 448/1600 and after plugging it in it moved to 448/3200. The router sits nearly on top of the master socket.
Can you clarify: if I keep it plugged directly into the main socket (disconnecting an extension) the speed will improve after 3 days? Presumable this means though that my extension socket will have to remain unusable?

Re: Plusnet, You have duped me..

ITWorks — Fri, 19 Feb 2010 18:36:23 GMT

Hi there
If you connection remain stable and you have no drop outs in 72 hrs (from when your router synced at 3200) you should see speeds of up to 2.5Mbps.
Its always best to have your router plugged into the master sockets to ensure you get the best speeds possible for your line. Using extensions can have a negative impact on your speed.
Regards
Mike

Re: Plusnet, You have duped me..

pierre_pierre — Fri, 19 Feb 2010 19:01:37 GMT

there are a few more fairly simple checks, but the experts have been on Holiday by the look of it, The checks will determine if it is your socket, filters or extension lead at fault.
If PN had called out BT without these checks, from your first answer you would have been saddled with a £140 bill as the fault is your side of the BT socket.
So bear with it, do the simple checks and hopefully you will get more than the AOL 2 M

Re: Plusnet, You have duped me..

ronroam1 — Fri, 19 Feb 2010 22:53:24 GMT

Mike and Pierre_Pierre,
Thank you both for your reassurance. If anything has come out of this it's an appreciation of the advice from this forum and the participation ( occasionally ) from PN staff.
I'll keep monitoring over the next 3 days to see if my previous speed of 2MB (with AOL) returns and, hopefully, track down the root cause of the problem.
Cheers.

Re: Plusnet, You have duped me..

bobpullen — Mon, 22 Feb 2010 09:19:12 GMT

Quote from: ronroam1
I'll keep monitoring over the next 3 days to see if my previous speed of 2MB (with AOL) returns and, hopefully, track down the root cause of the problem.

Looks like it jumped back up to 2500kbps on Saturday night

Re: Plusnet, You have duped me..

ronroam1 — Mon, 22 Feb 2010 16:54:13 GMT

Bob,
That's good news and thanks for letting me know. I left home on a trip about teatime on Saturday and have been away since.Up to then on Saturday it was pretty constant at 1370kb.
There was a jump straightaway from 700kb to 1370kb after I had connected straight into the BT socket.
However, I'm now left without the use of my phone extension.
Any suggestions on how I can keep the 2.5MB and also my extension?
Regards,
Ron

Re: Plusnet, You have duped me..

shutter — Mon, 22 Feb 2010 17:05:51 GMT

So long as you have a filter in the socket, you can put your phone back, and also have your router on an extension.... you only need to power down to move the router, ONCE and then power back up again.... with luck, you will also see an increase in your speed !.... Just take your time, in the move..... make sure everything is in place, then plug in and let the system sort itself out..... there really should be no problem...
Just thought, you need to make sure your extension socket has the filter in it for the modem ....
Am assuming your extension is "hard wired" from the master socket with this kind of wire......
http://www.phonesockets.co.uk/images/products/internalcablewith4wires.jpg
and not the "flat" DIY extension cable....

Re: Plusnet, You have duped me..

ronroam1 — Mon, 22 Feb 2010 18:36:32 GMT

The extension is 'hard wired' from the main socket as installed by BT and it is in another room.It has always had a filter connected. The reason for the recent improvement in speed is that I plugged directly into the main socket after unscrewing the plate this must have eliminated the noise issue that caused reduction in speed.
In plugging back into the original socket won't that cause the noise issue to return?

Re: Plusnet, You have duped me..

shutter — Mon, 22 Feb 2010 18:50:46 GMT

Undo the plate on the extension and make sure there are only two single copper wires attached to the middle two connections (either side of where the phone plug goes in) these are number 2 and 5.... if there is another wire connected to any other connection, carefully remove it from the connection..... withouth disturbing the number 2 and 5.... if there is no other wire connected, then it should be ok to re position the router and the phone, as previously said.... (the third wire is commonly referred to as "the bell wire" and was needed to power the ringer on earlier phones.... not needed now)... ( it is also the cause of interference/noise on the line..... )
Prior to moving the router. access the router, and make a note of the Download Attenuation, the Download SNR and the synch speed...... power down as I said , then reposition the router..... after it has settled down, (within 5 minutes of connection) access the router again and not the above figures again.... Post them both on here, and also do a BT speed test....post the result here....
Edit....
It would be better if you could do the router move during daylight hours...... best between 10:30 and 14:30.....

Re: Plusnet, You have duped me..

ronroam1 — Mon, 22 Feb 2010 19:03:51 GMT

Thanks Shutter,
but why do I need to reposition the router?
I'm away from home right now and back on Friday so can check for superflous wires then although BT installed all the wiring (previously Virgin cable) only 3 years ago so perhaps this won't have a bell wire?

Re: Plusnet, You have duped me..

Oldjim — Mon, 22 Feb 2010 19:10:26 GMT

If you are happy staying with the master (test) socket you don't need to

Re: Plusnet, You have duped me..

shutter — Mon, 22 Feb 2010 19:32:14 GMT

You don`t have to !.... I assumed from your posts that you preferred it on the extension, as you said you had plugged it into the master socket, and reduced the noise,.... !... just screw the master socket face plate back on, and plug in your router again, and the phone extension should work.... (with a filter on the phone connection)

Re: Plusnet, You have duped me..

Oldjim — Mon, 22 Feb 2010 20:15:25 GMT

If you do that the problem may well come back as putting the faceplate back on will bring the extension wiring into play.
if you do it check the sync speed immediately afterwards and if it is unchanged you can leave it where it is. But if it drops significantly put it back into the test socket within about 30 minutes and the short drop in speed shouldn't impact the IP Profile
You can then either put in an ADSLNation filtered faceplate which will sort it or just disconnect the extension wires from the faceplate and tuck them out of the way (I would wrap the ends in insulating tape for safety.
If you go down the filtered faceplate route remember to buy a disposable IDC insertion tool (ADSLNation sell them) http://www.adslnation.com/phpapps/catalog/

Re: Plusnet, You have duped me..

shutter — Mon, 22 Feb 2010 20:23:40 GMT

Agreed Jim,
but... he said this.....

Quote

However, I'm now left without the use of my phone extension.

So he will need to replace the faceplate, to see if his extension is indeed causing the problem, AND also to be able to use the phone extension !....
If he makes sure he only has 2 & 5 connected from the master socket , then hopefully, everything should work ok.....