topic Re: landlines are changing e-mail in Home Phone

landlines are changing e-mail

stevejd58 — Wed, 10 Sep 2025 20:22:01 GMT

Just received the email titled as in the subject which makes me think changes are closer than we think in Plusnet world

"Did you know landlines are going digital across the UK?
The current landline network is becoming outdated and will be retired by 2027. All home phones and broadband will soon be upgraded to a new, more reliable digital system."

Well we've been hearing this for a while so my question is;
Is Plusnet going to support to the bitter end of PSTN in Jan 2027 or will the following
https://www.openreach.co.uk/cpportal/updates/briefings/general-briefings/gen06624

force them to act sooner?

Re: landlines are changing e-mail

bmc — Wed, 10 Sep 2025 20:33:22 GMT

@stevejd58

I've long believed PN would give 90 days notice to cease their phone services to match the OpenReach declaration of all phone services will cease on the 31st December unless exemptions are granted (mainly for telecare services). Running out of time for that one.

However, it will be before Jan 2027 as OR are trying to clear the decks so that any remaining lines can be identified and problems dealt with by that date..

Whatever the actual date you should start planning now for the future if you need a landline so you know what's required when the time eventually comes.

Brian

Re: landlines are changing e-mail

corringham — Thu, 11 Sep 2025 07:38:15 GMT

@stevejd58 I expect only those with telecare alarms will keep a landline into 2026 - Plusnet/BT/etc can't leave everyone until the last moment, they will have to migrate most customers before then. Plusnet maybe have it easier because they don't offer VoIP, so it can be a case of PSTN is being switch off and here's EE's number of you want to migrate to them to keep your phone number. As many people no longer use a landline most Plusnet customers can be moved to SOGEA without much effort from Plusnet.

I think @bmc is right in suggesting Plusnet will give 90 days notice. October, November, December is about 90 days, so I'd guess the first PSTN termination notices to go out around the end of the month.

Re: landlines are changing e-mail

pvmb — Thu, 11 Sep 2025 15:58:19 GMT

"As many people no longer use a landline most Plusnet customers can be moved to SOGEA without much effort from Plusnet."

Not saying this won't happen, but Plusnet people seem reluctant to do this on a contract renewal. When renewing my old contract - ended today - I asked about SOGEA and they went on about "the exchange will eventually be shut down" and only offered me the same price as the fibre contract. So...

Re: landlines are changing e-mail

bmc — Thu, 11 Sep 2025 16:42:09 GMT

@pvmb

There is little saving to be had in ending phone services - most of the cost is in providing and maintaining the copper wire to your premises.

Likewise with Full Fibre - due to the high cost of installing the network to a property.

If you're interested there's an article here on the Exchange closure program.

https://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2025/09/openreach-to-start-exiting-next-12-uk-exchanges-in-q3-2025-26.html

Brian

Re: landlines are changing e-mail

corringham — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 07:52:14 GMT

@pvmb I think it is reasonable at contract renewal to push people to FTTP where it is available (although that isn't close to everywhere yet). However, when it comes to moving 100K customers off PSTN in 90 days there won't be enough time to install FTTP for everyone.

One of the reasons for 18-24 month contracts is to spread out the overhead of dealing with renewals. The PSTN switch off is going to compress a lot of contract renegotiations so they won't have time to do more than the minimum.

Re: landlines are changing e-mail

Baldrick1 — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 08:38:19 GMT

@corringham wrote:

when it comes to moving 100K customers off PSTN in 90 days there won't be enough time to install FTTP for everyone.

Where do these figures come from?

Some contributers ro this topic seem to be determined to spread worry and anxiety based on no more than an old Openreach document, that hasn't been recently substantiated. Plusnet have indicated that all customers will be moved off the PSTN before January 2027, not the end of 2025.

There is a risk that people who wish to keep a combined data and telephone service reading this will be persuaded to move to EE or other provider sooner than when it becomes necessary.

To encourage this before the Plusnet email service is fully ported to Greenby could be catastrophic for any not understanding the implications.

Re: landlines are changing e-mail

corringham — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 09:24:53 GMT

@Baldrick1, my figures are just ballpark figures from statistics gathered from annual reports etc. I don't know exactly how many customers Plusnet have, but some rough estimate can be calculated from available figures.

I haven't checked the latest available reports, but for 23-24 Plusnet's revenue was £400M - if you assume the average monthly charge is £30, then that gives about 1.1M customers.

That same report stated that 76% of broadband customers have Fibre (that's FTTC and FTTP). That leaves 24% on ADSL - that's upwards of a quarter of a million ADSL connections dependent on PSTN!

Now, things will have changed since then (I hope), and there is also no figures for how many FTTC customers are already on SOGEA.

So, lets say half the 76% fibre customers are on FTTP or SOGEA, and lets say half of the ADSL customers have been moved to FTTC SOGEA (or EE or some altnet). That leaves 500,000 or so customers with PSTN. That will be an average of 100K per quarter starting now to transfer them by the end of 2026. That's over 1000 per working day.

The BT group as a whole has 8M broadband customers, plus there are many more ISPs that use OR infrastructure. So you will be looking at many thousands per day in total.

These are just rough figures and may be out by quite a lot, but I'm still confident in saying that there won't be enough time to install FTTP for everyone.

Re: landlines are changing e-mail

Baldrick1 — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 09:51:21 GMT

@corringham wrote:
These are just rough figures and may be out by quite a lot, but I'm still confident in saying that there won't be enough time to install FTTP for everyone.

But there’s no connection between the installation of FTTP and the switch off of the PSTN!

As far as Plusnet are concerned the only additional work, apart from advisory messages, will be customers with ADSL/FTTC who currently have contracts that run late into 2026 will need to be given sufficient notice of the need to move or ‘upgrade’ to SoGEA or FTTP (if available).

Re: landlines are changing e-mail

corringham — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 10:04:48 GMT

@Baldrick1 wrote:

But there’s no connection between the installation of FTTP and the switch off of the PSTN!

Yes, that's part of the point I was making in response to the observation that Plusnet staff are pushing FTTP when customers want to renew their existing broadband + PSTN connection.

customers with ADSL/FTTC who currently have contracts that run late into 2026 will need to be given sufficient notice of the need to move or ‘upgrade’ to SoGEA or FTTP (if available).

The other part of my point is that Plusnet can't leave everything to the last moment, as there is no way to migrate many thousands of customers instantly. Even starting now it will be a massive undertaking - leaving it for a year will be a total car crash.

Re: landlines are changing e-mail

outcast — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 10:10:19 GMT

Grok calculates -

To address the scenario where Plusnet issues a 90-day notice specifically to customers actively using an analogue landline phone (requiring migration to VoIP for continued phone service, alongside converting their copper broadband to SoADSL or SoGEA for broadband-only access), the focus shifts to the subset of copper-based customers who actually use the landline, rather than all provisioned bundles.

Number of Affected Customers

Plusnet's total broadband customer base remains estimated at approximately 750,000 in 2025, based on historical figures adjusted for reported declines (e.g., a 9% drop following the 2024 mobile service closure) and BT Group's overall portfolio.
Of these, ~69.5% (521,000) are on copper-based services (ADSL or FTTC), which are the only ones eligible for analogue landline bundling ahead of the PSTN switch-off.
UK-wide, nearly all copper broadband services are provisioned with a landline bundle (due to traditional line rental inclusion), so assume ~100% of Plusnet's copper customers have the service available.
However, active usage is much lower: Recent surveys indicate 41-52% of UK households have a landline provisioned, but only 15% use it regularly (or ~29% of those with the service use it at least occasionally). Applying this usage rate to Plusnet's copper base yields approximately 151,000 customers actively using an analogue landline.

These customers would receive the notice, as they rely on the service and need VoIP migration (e.g., via a compatible router or third-party provider, since Plusnet is not offering it post-switch-off).

Daily Conversion Rate for ADSL and FTTC Lines

To complete broadband migrations to SoADSL (for ADSL) or SoGEA (for FTTC/VDSL) within 90 days—enabling VoIP overlay—the affected copper lines must be converted to broadband-only. VoIP setup is separate but requires the underlying broadband to be stable and PSTN-disconnected.

UK-wide copper breakdown (applied proportionally to Plusnet's 151,000 affected users):

ADSL: ~11.5% (~17,400 lines).
FTTC: ~88.5% (~133,600 lines).

To meet the deadline:

Total lines to convert: 151,000 / 90 days ≈ 1,680 lines per day.
ADSL lines: 17,400 / 90 days ≈ 190 per day.
FTTC lines: 133,600 / 90 days ≈ 1,490 per day.

This assumes uniform pacing, no churn, and sufficient engineering resources. In reality, Plusnet would need to coordinate with Openreach for migrations, offer VoIP guidance (potentially partnering with BT Digital Voice), and target vulnerable users first

Re: landlines are changing e-mail

corringham — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 10:28:47 GMT

@outcast thanks for Grok's opinion.

So that suggests there are 151,000 active PSTN lines that need migrating. However, all the inactive PSTN lines need migrating too - which gives 521,00 which is close to my 500,000 guess.

There are some interesting points that fall out of this:

if Plusnet migrate active PSTN users to EE, then they will be set to lose 151,000 customers - ouch!
however, ADSL users can't be migrated to EE so what happens to them? - but Plusnet lose them anyway
Grok suggest vulnerable customers should be dealt with first - I'm not sure that will happen as telecare alarms are a reason the PSTN switch off was delayed to 2027
I have a suspicion that Plusnet have a higher %age of ADSL customers than the industry average

Re: landlines are changing e-mail

outcast — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 10:59:46 GMT

@corringham wrote:

However, all the inactive PSTN lines need migrating too

The UK average for, copper lines that haven't yet been converted to broadband only, is ~44%

521000 : total of all Plusnet copper lines,

151000 : previously calculated Plusnet active phone customer total

370000 : subtracting already accounted for phone users, from total copper lines, giving inactive PSTN lines

162800 : assuming 44% of copper lines still need converting

1809 : Plusnet non-phone users to be converted per day over 90 days

So Plusnet would need to convert -

1680 : phone users per day

1809 : non-phone users per day

3489 : total number of copper lines to be converted to broadband only every day over a 90 day period !

Well good luck with doing that !

Re: landlines are changing e-mail

alex_h1 — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 10:59:56 GMT

Plusnet don't have all that much control over the matter. Openreach are transferring everybody to Full fibre - we had a notice from them a few weeks ago, though only saying it would be "in the next 12 months".

Once transferred by Openreach, you simply cannot have an analogue phone line any more, and will have to transfer to one of the FTTP services.

It appears that if you want to keep a "landline" phone, you will also have to transfer to EE.

Re: landlines are changing e-mail

corringham — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 11:03:18 GMT

@outcast wrote:

3489 : total number of copper lines to be converted to broadband only every day over a 90 day period !

That's over 90 days. However, there are 331 working days before the end of 2026 so it averages out at only 949 per day (starting today).

Re: landlines are changing e-mail

corringham — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 11:07:47 GMT

@alex_h1 wrote:

Openreach are transferring everybody to Full fibre - we had a notice from them a few weeks ago, though only saying it would be "in the next 12 months".

They simply can't transfer everyone to Full Fibre - it isn't available everywhere, and there aren't plans to reach a lot of places until 2030 or later (if at all).

They will transfer people in some areas, and you may be lucky enough to live in an area where Full Fibre is soon to be available.

You can stay with Plusnet and have a VoIP phone - but you will have to use a 3rd party supplier and arrange it yourself.

Re: landlines are changing e-mail

jab1 — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 11:15:51 GMT

@alex_h1 OpenReach are eventually transferring everyone to FTTP - but it is a long process, the current prediction is 'by 2030', although that could and probably will, change.

FTTC (or SoGEA, as it will be) will be around for a while as some locations will be difficult/extremely expensive to provision FTTP in.

If FTTP is available, you will be strongly advised to move to it - in fact many exchange areas are now FTTP Priority, so any move to another ISP will entail a move to that technology - no question.

If you want to keep a landline but don't want to move to EE, you can choose any provider you like - a few of whom offer a combined 'broadband' and phone service, but if they don't there is a choice of VoIP providers out there.

Re: landlines are changing e-mail

outcast — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 11:32:13 GMT

@corringham wrote:

However, there are 331 working days before the end of 2026 so it averages out at only 949 per day (starting today).

The other permutation, depending on how you read GEN066/24 , is that if the 90 day notice starts from 31st December 2025,

which the 90th day would be 31st March 2026, that is 200 days from now, which is 1569 per day IF Plusnet started TODAY !

However there seems to be so much push-back from customer's not willing to convert until they are forced to, the majority of lines conversions won't get underway until people are faced with the 90 day deadline, so > 3000 per day is going to be more likely.

Re: landlines are changing e-mail

bmc — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 11:29:13 GMT

@alex_h1

The notification you have received will be along the lines of Full Fibre should be available to you in the next 12 months. It will be your choice as to whether to move to it or not.

For those who choose not to move or it isn't available you will be moved to an OR product called SOGEA which is basically the internet without a phone service option. It uses the "last mile" copper wire from the FTTC cabinet to your property.

The most trouble will come for those on ADSL who do not have the option of FTTP. There is a digital product available but very few ISP's offer it as an option. PN don't. I believe BT (not EE) are one of the few who do.

Brian

Re: landlines are changing e-mail

corringham — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 12:14:37 GMT

@outcast wrote:

However there seems to be so much push-back from customer's not willing to convert until they are forced to, the majority of lines conversions won't get underway until people are faced with the 90 day deadline, so > 3000 per day is going to be more likely.

I fear you are correct. What surprises me is that Plusnet are (as far as I know) still allowing renewals with PSTN at all.

The best case migration rate is challenging. The worst case migration rate is, well, really challenging.

I was going to say that the call centre wait times will get really bad once they start cutting off PSTN and everyone phones in to find out what's happening - but then I realized it won't be that bad because nobody will have a working phone line!