topic Re: New FTTP installation in My Order

New FTTP installation

ToeKnee60 — Thu, 22 Feb 2024 21:22:57 GMT

When the engineer installed my fibre connection from the telegraph pole and ONT today he left the old copper line from the pole to the telephone socket and told me it was so it could be used as a backup in case of problems with the fibre installation.
We don't have a landline.

Presumably in the near future it will be disconnected from the exchange. How long is that likely to be?

The reason that I ask is once I know it is no longer live I plan to remove the old telephone wire from the front of the house and inside the house to make it look tidier.

He also said it may take a few days for the connection to settle. I have done a few speed tests ant it varied between 495Mbs and 397 Mb/s down and between 60 Mbs and 45 Mb/s up. I have the 500Mbs service.
How long is the settling period?

Re: New FTTP installation

Shep41 — Thu, 22 Feb 2024 21:44:31 GMT

With full fibre there is no settling period, you will get full speed straight away

Re: New FTTP installation

Anonymous — Thu, 22 Feb 2024 22:07:42 GMT

@ToeKnee60 wrote:

... told me it was so it could be used as a backup in case of problems with the fibre installation.

That seems a sensible thing to do, as there have been a few reported FTTP installations that fail in the first few days, with no way of reverting back in cases where the copper wires were removed.

@ToeKnee60 wrote:

Presumably in the near future it will be disconnected from the exchange. How long is that likely to be?

It is unlikely that your wires will be disconnected in the exchange before decommissioning from 2027 to 2035.

Even with the analogue phone system closing at the end of 2025, and all FTTC lines converted to SoGEA, the wires will remain connected in the exchange, even though the VDSL broadband signal comes from the roadside FTTC cabinet.

@ToeKnee60 wrote:

He also said it may take a few days for the connection to settle. ... ... How long is the settling period?

I would think that your physical connection has settled already, but account related IP profiles might take a day or two to be applied by Openreach and Plusnet.

Re: New FTTP installation

jab1 — Fri, 23 Feb 2024 07:09:41 GMT

That seems a sensible thing to do, as there have been a few reported FTTP installations that fail in the first few days, with no way of reverting back in cases where the copper wires were removed.

My understanding is that once you have been connected to FTTP, the FTTC connection is removed, and there is no way of going back. I may be wrong, and am happy to be corrected. You may still have the physical copper left in place, but it no longer has a signal.

@ToeKnee60 Be very careful about 'removing the old telephone wire from the front of the house,,,,,' - that is OpenReach's property, and you are not allowed to play with it.

Re: New FTTP installation

Baldrick1 — Fri, 23 Feb 2024 08:40:03 GMT

Moderator's note:
Thread moved from Fukk Fibre to My Order

Re: New FTTP installation

Ian06 — Fri, 23 Feb 2024 09:14:57 GMT

I saw this a little while back on ISPReview: Remove Copper Line

So it looks like you can request the cable be remove when you are happy you no longer want it.

Re: New FTTP installation

MisterW — Fri, 23 Feb 2024 09:21:56 GMT

If the exchange is 'Fibre priority' then there's no point in retaining the copper wire, Openreach won't accept an order for any service using it!!.

Re: New FTTP installation

jgb — Fri, 23 Feb 2024 11:02:02 GMT

Looking at it another way, if the copper wire and master socket are redundant following full fibre install why should the householder be left with the socket rather than it being removed as part of the full fibre install (assuming it is a service installed by Openreach) ? When we upgrade to full fibre the ONT will need to go where the master socket is - the external duct terminates just outside that point, the existing drop wire comes through the wall there, and there are mains sockets adjacent and we do not want the old socket cluttering things up.

Re: New FTTP installation

jab1 — Fri, 23 Feb 2024 11:13:14 GMT

In your specific case, @jgb I suspect the ONT will go where the master socket is currently, but there are instance, like mine, where the MS is located well away from the fibre entry point, and I may ask the installers if they can remove it, although there then remains the inside cabling - which runs halfway across the house through skirting, door frames and a wall.

Re: New FTTP installation

Batfrog — Fri, 23 Feb 2024 17:35:36 GMT

@ToeKnee60 Curious thing this not removing the old copper wire. As has been said it’s totally redundant, even if the FTTP should fail – at least that’s what I understand.

I went from FTTC to FTTP a couple of months ago. When the engineer arrived I said “I’ll tell you what I want and you tell me what I can have”. We soon reached a compromise and the job was soon completed.

FOUR of my immediate neighbours have both copper and fibre going to their properties – totally pointless (I think) as at least two of them I know don’t have landlines PSTN or even VOIP.

I asked the engineer (as part of what I wanted) if he could remove the old copper pointing out how unsightly the telegraph pole was. “No problem” he said I’ll cut it off and use the existing bracket for the fibre. When I asked why the others hadn’t been removed he shrugged and said “idle B%**!$s, can’t be bothered, I’ve got to go up the pole anyway so why not”

I didn’t want a new bracket on the eaves a foot from the existing and two ‘cables’ like one of my near neighbours.

Since then I’ve become a bit obsessed, walking around the neighbourhood looking just how many properties have more than one ‘cable’.

Yes, Yes I know about 5^th September last but I don’t think that explains them all !!

Re: New FTTP installation

ToeKnee60 — Fri, 23 Feb 2024 21:48:59 GMT

The guy who installed it was a subcontractor from a company called Kelly Group. He said that they normally leave the old connection as a backup, so now I have 2 cables from the telegraph pole to different points on the front of my house.
He made a neat looking job of the install, but I am now left with redundant cabling outside and inside the house.

Thanks @Ian06 for the link to the ISPreview article. I will probably leave it a month then contact Openreach to remove the redundant copper cable if it is going to be free of charge.
Does anyone know how to contact Openreach to request this?

@jab1 The ONT is on the front wall almost behind the outside box. The telephone master socket is on a different wall about 2m away.
@MisterW our exchange is not a "fibre priority" exchange.

Re: New FTTP installation

greygit1 — Fri, 23 Feb 2024 21:52:17 GMT

Copper has a scrap value worth. Accrue enough of it and off to the local metal recycler.

Admittedly, stripping off the plastic casing can be time consuming. But there are tools.

(I once 'upset' a central heating installer by removing all the stripped out copper - and brass - and took it to a local metal recycler. There was nothing in their install contract that specifically included them having to have exclusive access to the stuff they stripped out.)

Re: New FTTP installation

RobPN — Fri, 23 Feb 2024 22:30:21 GMT

@ToeKnee60 wrote:

The guy who installed it was a subcontractor from a company called Kelly Group. He said that they normally leave the old connection as a backup, so now I have 2 cables from the telegraph pole to different points on the front of my house.
He made a neat looking job of the install, but I am now left with redundant cabling outside and inside the house.

Kellys operatives (and presumably those from other subcontractors) get paid a fixed amount per job, so to remove the copper wire would take extra time which could be used more profitably elsewhere. The amount they get paid doesn't compare with the way OR staff are paid.

Re: New FTTP installation

jab1 — Sat, 24 Feb 2024 07:18:41 GMT

@ToeKnee60 wrote:

@jab1 The ONT is on the front wall almost behind the outside box. The telephone master socket is on a different wall about 2m away.

Doesn't matter where it is, it is still the property of OpenReach.

Re: New FTTP installation

ToeKnee60 — Sat, 24 Feb 2024 13:46:13 GMT

Thats why I was proposing to contact Openreach to ask if they can remove the old redundant connection from the telegraph pole and down the front of the house.
Do you know how I can contact then directly or do I need to go via Plusnet customer services?

Re: New FTTP installation

Anonymous — Sat, 24 Feb 2024 13:52:28 GMT

@ToeKnee60 does the form on this Openreach page help you ?

https://www.openreach.com/building-developers-and-projects/altering-our-network/for-consumer-and-business-customers

Re: New FTTP installation

jab1 — Sat, 24 Feb 2024 13:53:55 GMT

See the link in @Ian06 's post above.

Re: New FTTP installation

ToeKnee60 — Sat, 24 Feb 2024 14:02:20 GMT

Thanks @Anonymous That seems to have the information I need and a link to a form to be filled in.
There was a link in the ISPreview article that Ian06 posted, but unfortunately that link is no longer live.

Re: New FTTP installation

Mark63 — Sun, 25 Feb 2024 18:09:23 GMT

@ToeKnee60 wrote:

Thats why I was proposing to contact Openreach to ask if they can remove the old redundant connection from the telegraph pole and down the front of the house.
Do you know how I can contact then directly or do I need to go via Plusnet customer services?

Contact Openreach directly, it is no longer being 'rented' by Plusnet (on your behalf or directly)

I'd be interested to know what they charge. They wanted 300 quid (plus VAT) from me just to provide a quotation to move their line from one part of my house to another. I told them to forget it.

Re: New FTTP installation

Anonymous — Sun, 25 Feb 2024 19:16:41 GMT

Hopefully it won't cost anything if the email response from Openreach in this post was anything to go by -

I can't understand why Openreach bothered to mention the cost of moving a telephone line, and then immediately acknowledge that the customer had asked for the redundant line to be removed ?