topic Re: Has anyone had a good experience of moving from FFTC to FFTP? in Full Fibre

Has anyone had a good experience of moving from FFTC to FFTP?

Clarissa — Sat, 22 Feb 2025 14:14:34 GMT

I can see a lot of posts from unhappy customers still waiting for their FFTP service to be installed/activated, and many can't seem to get the support they need on the phone. It is quite alarming.

I will soon be going out of contract and was thinking of upgrading from FFTC to FFTP whilst staying with PN, as I have been looked after fairly well by PN over the years, but I'm now wondering if it is better to do OTS to Zen? Or order FFTP with Zen and then cancel FFTC with PN?

Judging by the amount of time it seems to take to get the cabling/ONT sorted, according to the poor experiences people are having, it looks like I will be well into my out-of-contract period before FFTP is installed and activated at my address. Clearly, I should have looked into this much sooner...

Is there any hope? There must be some customers out there who have had a good experience?

Re: Has anyone had a good experience of moving from FFTC to FFTP?

MisterW — Sat, 22 Feb 2025 14:21:37 GMT

Is there any hope? There must be some customers out there who have had a good experience?

There are many customers who's FTTP install was straighforward BUT they dont usually post on the forums!. In general you only see posts about the ones that go 'pear shaped'.

My install (an overhead line) was straightforward, took around 90 mins.

Re: Has anyone had a good experience of moving from FFTC to FFTP?

jab1 — Sat, 22 Feb 2025 14:27:42 GMT

Me too, @MisterW , although it took a little longer as the guy was really conscientious and careful - top marks for the job.

@Clarissa What does it say in the narrative at the foot of this link for your property? : https://www.broadbandchecker.btwholesale.com/#/ADSL

Re: Has anyone had a good experience of moving from FFTC to FFTP?

Clarissa — Sat, 22 Feb 2025 15:06:04 GMT

I checked it out on the site but I am having trouble attaching a copy of the result to this thread

It looks like there should be no issues with installing FFTP

It says it's OH feed with no anticipated issues, FFTP is available, it's a one stage process and a new ONT can be ordered

Thank you for guiding me

Re: Has anyone had a good experience of moving from FFTC to FFTP?

bmc — Sat, 22 Feb 2025 15:08:37 GMT

@Clarissa

Even if you move you still have to wait for OpenReach to do the install and if there are any problems on the day it's (usually) down to OR.

I assume you realise moving to FTTP costs you your copper phone line.

Brian

Re: Has anyone had a good experience of moving from FFTC to FFTP?

Smith7 — Sat, 22 Feb 2025 15:11:16 GMT

We have been told by EE that when our contract ends in May as we are on FTTC we will have to move to FTTP as cables for FTTP has been put in our close.

We are happy with the speeds of our present system

EE say all providers will have to do the same as it's Openreach not themselves

Anyone else come across this ?

Re: Has anyone had a good experience of moving from FFTC to FFTP?

Clarissa — Sat, 22 Feb 2025 15:17:03 GMT

I suspect all FFTC customers will be forced to move to FFTP eventually, and I suppose, by Dec27, when the landlines are all switched off

Re: Has anyone had a good experience of moving from FFTC to FFTP?

MisterW — Sat, 22 Feb 2025 15:27:32 GMT

We have been told by EE that when our contract ends in May as we are on FTTC we will have to move to FTTP as cables for FTTP has been put in our close.

We are happy with the speeds of our present system

EE say all providers will have to do the same as it's Openreach not themselves

Anyone else come across this ?

@Smith7

There are three Openreach rules that come into play:-

1) If your exchange is marked as 'Fibre priority' on the availability checker, then if FTTP is available to the address, then the ONLY product that can be ordered is FTTP.

2) Openreach are retiring the PSTN ( copper based phone service ) by 2027.

3) Its not been possible to place any new order for a PSTN connection since Sept 2023

See here https://www.beta.openreach.co.uk/cpportal/products/the-all-ip-programme/stopsell-updates

Re: Has anyone had a good experience of moving from FFTC to FFTP?

MisterW — Sat, 22 Feb 2025 15:34:43 GMT

@Clarissa

It says it's OH feed with no anticipated issues, FFTP is available, it's a one stage process and a new ONT can be ordered

The install should be straighforward in that case, its expected that all work should be completed in one visit ( 1-Stage )

Does the current cable go directly from the pole to your house ?

Is the current master socket in a convenient place for the ONT to be located i.e its within 1m of a power socket, located close to the router and at ground floor level on an external wall ?

Re: Has anyone had a good experience of moving from FFTC to FFTP?

Smith7 — Sat, 22 Feb 2025 15:37:01 GMT

@MisterW wrote:

3) Its not been possible to place any new order for a PSTN connection since Sept 2023

PlusNet say they can still offer a FFTC service but EE says this is wrong

Openreach are spending millions of pounds putting fibre cables in roads and are going to use them

Re: Has anyone had a good experience of moving from FFTC to FFTP?

Clarissa — Sat, 22 Feb 2025 15:48:50 GMT

Yes, the current cable is from the pole to the corner of the house at roof level, but it then splits into two lines. The line that feeds the socket for the internet runs along the side of the house and enters the house on the first floor. I have internet socket and router in the box bedroom (my home office) on the first floor. The landline is a separate feed across the front of the house and enters the living room on the ground floor. I want the ONT to be installed in the bedroom where the router currently is.

Re: Has anyone had a good experience of moving from FFTC to FFTP?

MisterW — Sat, 22 Feb 2025 16:00:35 GMT

The line that feeds the socket for the internet runs along the side of the house and enters the house on the first floor.

I want the ONT to be installed in the bedroom where the router currently is.

@Clarissa that MIGHT be a problem. The fibre from the pole is terminated in a grey box called a Customer Splice point (CSP) , this is usually externally fixed and MUST be at ground floor level (engineers can not use the splicing equipment at height). The ONT is then usually situtated opposite to the CSP on the internal side of the wall.

From your description , I suspect the engineer would expect to locate the ONT where the current line enters the living room , with the CSP on the outside of that wall, the external fibre taking a similar route to your current landline feed. The engineer CAN install up to 10m of fibre internally BUT they will not drill through walls and will just clip fibre to skirting boards, door frames etc

Re: Has anyone had a good experience of moving from FFTC to FFTP?

MisterW — Sat, 22 Feb 2025 16:06:14 GMT

@Smith7 PlusNet say they can still offer a FFTC service but EE says this is wrong

If your exchange is NOT marked as fibre priority, then PLusnet (and other providers) can still offer a broadband service over the copper line (SoGEA), which is basically FTTC without a landline phone service. Plusnet call that service 'Fibre' as opposed to 'Full fibre' which is FTTP.

Re: Has anyone had a good experience of moving from FFTC to FFTP?

Clarissa — Sat, 22 Feb 2025 18:26:45 GMT

Thanks for the heads up. Forewarned is forearmed.

I Googled this and found it MIGHT be possible to install the CSP at ground level, like you say it must be, but then run the fibre optic from the CSP across the outside of the building rather than the inside before entering the building through the wall to the ONT on the first floor. I hope I get a engineer willing to do this. Trying to run the cable internally from the ground floor living room at the front of house to the home office on the first floor at the back of the house is not an option .

I really want the router upstairs. A high up position in the back of the house gives a better Wi-Fi signal around the whole house and the back garden, and allows me to work on the laptop via ethernet cable. If router has to go in the living room, it will be in the way, unsightly, possibly require Wi-Fi extenders/mesh/or whatever and most of the signal will spread to the front garden, with none probably reaching the kitchen or the back garden.

So, I now need to decide between PN FF145 @ £26.99pm plus £3pm annual increases, an old Hub Two router (no Wi-Fi 6) for 24 months or take the leap of faith and go to Zen FF100 @ £28pm, a new Wi-Fi 6 router and no price increases for 18 months?

Zen is the cheaper and more future-proofed option, but who is best for customer service? Zen get the better Which? and Trust pilot scores but they don't have a community forum.

Will Hub Two still work in 2 years time? Will PN replace it? I have had problems trying to get it replaced. They would only do it once when I was on Hub One and was allowed to upgrade to Hub Two provided I renewed.

Re: Has anyone had a good experience of moving from FFTC to FFTP?

jab1 — Sat, 22 Feb 2025 18:37:14 GMT

True, Zen do not have a community forum, but their telephone support is excellent - you don't talk to call-centre agents, rather to people who know the specific problem you are calling about, and from my experience as a customer for ~4 years, they can usually fix most problems in one call - if they can't they will keep a 'ticket' open until the issue is fixed. Not that I have much experience of that - my one ticket was due to an issue that couldn't be fixed over the phone, and was quickly sorted. Updates to it were merely to inform me of progress and resolution.

Re: Has anyone had a good experience of moving from FFTC to FFTP?

bmc — Sat, 22 Feb 2025 18:50:30 GMT

@Clarissa

Although the CSP will probably be at ground level it's possible the installer will be happy to run the fibre cable back up the wall to enter at your preferred location.

Unfortunately you just don't know until they turn up. A good engineer will work with you if it's possible.

The router connects to the ONT via ethernet cable so doesn't have to be in the same location. If it's downstairs you could always get someone in to run a cable externally to your desired location upstairs.

If you leave PN you lose PN email it this matters.

Brian

Re: Has anyone had a good experience of moving from FFTC to FFTP?

Townman — Sat, 22 Feb 2025 19:15:21 GMT

@Clarissa wrote:

Is there any hope? There must be some customers out there who have had a good experience?

The issues you see around here are NOT related to the ISP, but BTOR FTTP installation issues / delays. This you would encounter the same with any ISP using BT supplied infrastructure.

By the way, it is double-T (To The) not double-F as in

FTTP - Fibre to the Property
FTTC - Fibre to the Cabinet (then copper to the property ... which will continue long after PTSN is switched off)

Re: Has anyone had a good experience of moving from FFTC to FFTP?

Anonymous — Sat, 22 Feb 2025 21:51:02 GMT

"In general you only see posts about the ones that go 'pear shaped'."

And there's little in the way of statistics to give any indication of the level of "pear-shapedness". I would also say that some who have 'pear-shaped' migrations/installs never get as far as the forums?

Re: Has anyone had a good experience of moving from FFTC to FFTP?

Clarissa — Sun, 23 Feb 2025 11:55:21 GMT

Thanks.

Not sure about the ethernet cable around the house idea. It would have to be an exceptionally long cable - probably over 16 meters. I wonder how much speed I might lose? And are ethernet cables weather proof for extreme cold, etc? Has anyone else installed one outside? Something else for me to Google I guess!

I don't bother with PlusNet email anymore, since they started deleting messages more than 3 months old. I was under the impression that their email service will cease to be available to everyone eventually anyway.

Re: Has anyone had a good experience of moving from FFTC to FFTP?

MisterW — Sun, 23 Feb 2025 12:12:53 GMT

I wonder how much speed I might lose?

You wont lose any speed, Cat5e or better cable is capable of 1Gb up to 100m.

And are ethernet cables weather proof for extreme cold, etc? Has anyone else installed one outside? Something else for me to Google I guess!

Provided its external grade cable it should be fine.