topic Re: Considering a return in Everything else

Considering a return

Marksfish — Mon, 03 Jun 2024 18:41:11 GMT

Looking at my options to escape Sky at the moment. The 3 BT companies all offer a similar product, but PN only guarantee much lower speeds on their products than BT/ EE do. e.g. speed guarantee on the BT 500meg line is 425, with PN it is only 275!! A big difference.

I was progressing an order with BT on a good deal, but I got to the credit check page and stopped. A credit check is not a problem, but as it is a hard check, I do not want to be checked if they are not going to offer a choice of installation dates further on. My Sky package ends on 1st July, so do not want the takeover immediately. I presume PN also require a credit check, but will it be before or after selecting a date? It seems a bit pointless checking out provider after provider and leaving a trail of hard credit checks. The system seems a bit a**e about face to me.

Thanks

Re: Considering a return

markhawkin — Mon, 03 Jun 2024 19:47:30 GMT

@Marksfish The only reason I can think of that Plusnet would have a lower speed guarantee would be that the Plusnet Hub 2 isn't as capable as the EE or BT supplied router. All 3 (and others) will have the same Openreach ONT and I don't believe Plusnet traffic is "deprioritsed",

Have a good shop around for Plusnet offers as prices seem to go up and down fairly often. I found the install lead time was about 2 weeks.

As you are considering an installation I assume you are FTTC rather than FTTP with Sky. If Sky is a full fibre then ther may well be no need for an install.

Re: Considering a return

Marksfish — Mon, 03 Jun 2024 20:09:21 GMT

Tanks Mark. I'm already FTTP, so it should just be a speed swap. I want to move from Sky as my line reliability on FTTP is not as good as on FTTC. Moving provider will help me prove if it is a line issue or a Sky issue.

If you think it may be the router that isn't up to it, I may be better off with one of the other 2 members of the company, the parent company have deals at the moment which PN don't. Currently only £1pm cheaper than BT with lower speed guarantees ☹️

Re: Considering a return

MisterW — Tue, 04 Jun 2024 06:36:25 GMT

If you think it may be the router that isn't up to it,

The supplied Hub 2 is prefectly capable of handling the 900/115 FTTP product using a wired connection. Yes, its only Wifi 5 which means a wireless maximum speed of around 400Mb. Unless both your wireless devices and the router are Wifi 6 cabable you're not going to improve on that.

I don't understand why the Plusnet guaranteed speeds are different, maybe its a BT group marketing directive to make BT/EE seem a more premium product. However its exactly the same Openreach product. Openreach DO have a prioritorisation of part of the bandwidth in exceptional circumstances which may be what PN are quoting but its the same for ALL suppliers.

I want to move from Sky as my line reliability on FTTP is not as good as on FTTC. Moving provider will help me prove if it is a line issue or a Sky issue.

@Marksfish in what way is it unreliable ? FTTP usually either works or it doesnt!

Re: Considering a return

Marksfish — Tue, 04 Jun 2024 06:46:16 GMT

@MisterW wrote:

@Marksfish in what way is it unreliable ? FTTP usually either works or it doesnt!

On FTTC, the connection was rock solid for up to 60 days at a time. Since FTTP, uptime is at best 20 days before the connection drops. Some days i'm lucky to get 20 hours connection time. It then stays off for a few hours, unless the router is restarted. The router shows a red voice led, but it in fact takes the whole internet down with it. Have had 4 routers from Sky now with the same issue. I have sent my Thinkbroadband BQM graphs to them and had BT engineers out to investigate, who have ignored all the evidence presented to them and said "it's working okay now". ONT stays green, although I don't know if it goes any other colour before noticing the connection has dropped as it is behind the settee, pointing to a potential router issue. It doesn't go off overnight, but at inconvenient times, like when on a wifi call, or when using my connection for a work issue.

By leaving Sky for another, I am hoping to prove it is either line or equipment issues.

Mark

Re: Considering a return

MisterW — Tue, 04 Jun 2024 07:48:47 GMT

Since FTTP, uptime is at best 20 days before the connection drops. Some days i'm lucky to get 20 hours connection time. It then stays off for a few hours, unless the router is restarted.

ONT stays green, although I don't know if it goes any other colour before noticing the connection has dropped as it is behind the settee

@Marksfish most odd!. It would be useful to see the ONT lights when its off. I suppose its possible there's an intermittent Fibre issue, but that would show up in the ONT lights.

Is there any log information in the Sky router ?

I'm on the 900/115 FTTP connection and I do get the occasional drop but its usually in the early hours and I assume its mostly down to OR maintenance.

Re: Considering a return

Marksfish — Tue, 04 Jun 2024 16:29:02 GMT

Every time I look at the ONT, I have 3 greens, even when there is no internet. Router logs are very basic, 12 pages of logs uploaded 😁. Most of it is gobbledegook, but does show the re- connection issue. This is a 150/ 50 service.

Mark

Re: Considering a return

MisterW — Tue, 04 Jun 2024 17:43:21 GMT

2023-03-13 19:20:35 syslog: [2169020.065000] eth3 (Ext switch port: 4) (Logical Port: 12) Link DOWN.
2023-03-13 19:20:35 syslog: eth3.1 - WAN link DOWN.
2023-03-13 19:20:35 syslog: DHCP lease expired from server. Connection DOWN.
2023-03-13 19:20:37 syslog: [2169022.078000] eth3 (Ext switch port: 4) (Logical Port: 12) Link UP 1000 mbps full duplex

2023-04-21 04:38:00 syslog: [3312435.427000] eth3 (Ext switch port: 4) (Logical Port: 12) Link DOWN.
2023-04-21 04:38:01 syslog: eth3.1 - WAN link DOWN.
2023-04-21 04:38:01 syslog: DHCP lease expired from server. Connection DOWN.
2023-04-21 04:38:03 syslog: [3312438.468000] eth3 (Ext switch port: 4) (Logical Port: 12) Link UP 1000 mbps full duplex
2023-04-21 04:38:04 syslog: Voice IP Connection Down
2023-04-21 04:38:07 syslog: Voice Disconnected
2023-04-21 05:09:17 syslog: No lease renewal received
2023-04-21 05:09:22 syslog: No lease renewal received

@Marksfish looking at those logs, you're getting a loss of link to the ONT for about 2 seconds. Problem is this takes down the WAN DHCP connection which seems not to recover. There is a problem with some typical router chipsets (particularly the MT7621) which exhibits similar problems. I had the problem with one of my routers but not quite as severe. In my case it took down the PPPoE connection but at least it recovered, although it took 30 secs or so.

Of course it could be an ONT problem, have Openreach ever replaced the ONT ?

The router has an inherent design fault, it ought to recover but I guess Sky aren't going to do much about that, apart from replacing it which, from what you say, they've already done.

Re: Considering a return

Marksfish — Tue, 04 Jun 2024 18:09:23 GMT

Thanks for taking the time and deciphering that, it didn't really mean a great deal to me. Openreach haven't replaced the ONT, I suppose that will be the next step if when I move the same thing happens. That said, would BT consider it a fault with it being so infrequent? As I say, it has only ever happened since FTTP, and many routers down the line with current firmware, no further forward. I haven't seen any other mention of it on the Sky board on TBB, but I it is very well frequented. I was going to set a timer once per week for a Sunday night, but with it dropping at random times throughout the day, that isn't really much of a solution.

Re: Considering a return

MisterW — Tue, 04 Jun 2024 18:31:59 GMT

As I say, it has only ever happened since FTTP

It will only affect FTTP. If its an ONT fault, then obviously it wouldnt have affected FTTC. If its the router chipset fault, then there's no direct physical Ethernet WAN link on FTTC, rather its an internal logical link to the DSL port, so no ethernet port to go down!

Re: Considering a return

Marksfish — Tue, 04 Jun 2024 19:31:25 GMT

I've since had a little Google and seems I am not the only person suffering this. It seems it is such a minority, Sky are interested in resolving it. A move is what is needed 😁

Re: Considering a return

markhawkin — Tue, 04 Jun 2024 20:41:13 GMT

@Marksfish

The evidence is starting to suggest a Sky router issue, so any supplier change will enable you to eliminate that.

I might pay a little bit to get the current BT router rather than the Plusnet supplied device.

If most of your connected devices use WiFi then you may or may not get any benefit from your speed upgrade,

I don't have the "latest and greatest" devices but nothing I have will exceed 300Mb/s irrespective of connection speed on a WiFi 6 capable router.

Mesh WiFi systems seem the best way of achieving speed improvements for most applications rather than a connection speed upgrade.

The latest high speed domestic Internet connections seem to just stop the incoming line being the bottleneck, a bit like a short stretch of dual carriageway moving the congestion somewhere else.

Re: Considering a return

Marksfish — Wed, 05 Jun 2024 06:03:15 GMT

A lot of my stuff is currently hard wired, but there are wireless devices. The 300 offering from PN is more than I need (to be honest, I could stay on 150 really), but at £1 less than the £5 offering from BT at the moment and the lower speed guarantees, I am struggling to justify it. Used to be PN were at least a fiver less than BT. I also notice PN are still doing the 3.8% + cpi increase, whereas the others are £3pa increase. Yes, almost a 10% increase annually, but at least you know how much each month.