topic Re: 35 years to discover a faulty wired Master socket in Everything else

35 years to discover a faulty wired Master socket

Leapy — Thu, 09 Jul 2020 07:59:03 GMT

When we moved in, 35 years ago, like most people, we only had phones.

We have not touched the wiring as it normally works OK.

Even switching providers (BT, 02, Sky, Virgin and PlusNet) and getting the internet, yesterday I discovered the test socket on the master socket, is not wired, so the test socket is useless!

Maybe things will get better or is this a case of it's working, so don't touch?

35 years to discover a problem

Re: 35 years to discover a faulty wired Master socket

Mook — Thu, 09 Jul 2020 08:20:37 GMT

Well it was connected at some point @Leapy as you can see by the broken wires around the screw heads. So someone's been at it, meaning it could have been anyone of the engineers that have turned up in that time so take your pick!

Re: 35 years to discover a faulty wired Master socket

MisterW — Thu, 09 Jul 2020 08:28:16 GMT

That doesn't look like a genuine BT NTE5 socket to me, the test socket is offset on a BT socket. Have you got any other sockets in the house ?

Looks like someone has tried to connect what appears to be a master socket, as an extension by not using the A & B terminals. They've failed!.

The 'test' socket you refer to must be live because the faceplate plugs into it.

Re: 35 years to discover a faulty wired Master socket

Bogbody — Thu, 09 Jul 2020 08:28:16 GMT

Are you sure thats your master socket?
It looks like its been wired as an extention. Is there an old GPO/BT socket near where the phone line enters the building?

Re: 35 years to discover a faulty wired Master socket

Leapy — Thu, 09 Jul 2020 09:41:51 GMT

@Bogbody @MisterW That is the one next to the front door, where the wire from the telegraph pole comes in and it's the only one that has a two part front and a test socket. All the others (3) just extension sockets.

@Mook I don't think we have ever had any Telecoms Engineers enter and look at it as each switch has been done without a visit, and they all just send you a router.

One interesting point, is that wherever the router goes either on the master or extensions, it works exactly the same. The only reason I'm looking at it now is because, I'm on PlusNet Fibre Extra my download is limited to under 40mbps and the upload, shows a possible 20mbps, but that is always under 8mbps.

Re: 35 years to discover a faulty wired Master socket

Leapy — Thu, 09 Jul 2020 10:08:15 GMT

@MisterW @Bogbody FYI - The Master socket has a number AC749297 and a "T" logo on the front. I have no idea if it's genuine or not, but it doesn't look right and I presume I'm missing some electronics from the test circuit?

Re: 35 years to discover a faulty wired Master socket

MisterW — Thu, 09 Jul 2020 10:19:45 GMT

@Leapy Ahh! I hadn't appreciated that in the first picture, the wires were connected to the faceplate, rather than the backplate.

That IS a genuine BT NTE5 BUT its definitely not wired correctly. As @Bogbody says that's not the master socket, its wired as an extension. Well in fact it's wired VERY strangely, normally the incoming cable would be wired to the A & B terminals and the wires from the faceplate are to feed other extensions.. That doesn't look like the incoming BT cable , it wouldn't normally be white 6 core cable. You must have another socket or joint box where the incoming cable is connected.

Re: 35 years to discover a faulty wired Master socket

idonno — Thu, 09 Jul 2020 10:26:22 GMT

@Leapy wrote:

The only reason I'm looking at it now is because, I'm on PlusNet Fibre Extra my download is limited to under 40mbps and the upload, shows a possible 20mbps, but that is always under 8mbps.

Maybe 40 / 10? FWIW, My upload speed shows a possible 25Mb/s but it never goes above 20Mb (usually 19.99!)

Re: 35 years to discover a faulty wired Master socket

Anonymous — Thu, 09 Jul 2020 10:35:25 GMT

Hi Leapy

If that socket is where the connection comes in from outside there are only two wires connected

So how are the three extensions getting their connection from the master

There must be a connection somewhere else how many wires are connected in the extensions

When you get an incoming call do all the phones ring together

Any chance of a picture

Re: 35 years to discover a faulty wired Master socket

Bogbody — Thu, 09 Jul 2020 11:38:39 GMT

Thats definately NOT the master socket.
If the cables come straight in from the pole then Bodger has been very busy.
🙂

Re: 35 years to discover a faulty wired Master socket

Leapy — Thu, 09 Jul 2020 13:43:33 GMT

@Bogbody @Anonymous The black thick Telegraph Pole Cable comes through the window frame and into the small box with a T on it (see first photo below), that white cable from it, runs down to the bigger Master socket (also with a T on it, as shown in previous photos).

All the 3 extensions are like this one (see second photo below).

When we moved in all 4 extensions only had phones/fax and rang. I think, there was an issue as all phones (and fax machines) had to be REN1 to ring and work and some phones/fax machines didn't have clear REN ratings. https://www.britishtelephones.com/ren.htm

Inside connection to outside black cable from Telegraph Pole. White cable leads to Master Socket boxAn extension box

Re: 35 years to discover a faulty wired Master socket

MisterW — Thu, 09 Jul 2020 13:54:46 GMT

So where are the cables to the extension sockets ?

In a correctly wired system , the extension sockets are wired from the faceplate on the master socket, but as has been mentioned previously , there is only one cable going to the 'master' socket.

Looks like you've almost certainly got some form of 'star' wiring , which is very likely affecting your speed.

Re: 35 years to discover a faulty wired Master socket

Bogbody — Thu, 09 Jul 2020 13:59:30 GMT

Some one in the past has removed and "old style" GPO socket or even a hard wired fixed phone and replaced it with a bodged in "new style" BT plug in socket.
Unless there is some hidden old wiring connected in somewhere.
Time to involve BT (Warning - potential cost involved!!!) or a competant person well versed in fixing BT bodges. 😀😀

Re: 35 years to discover a faulty wired Master socket

Leapy — Thu, 09 Jul 2020 15:04:01 GMT

@MisterW wrote:

So where are the cables to the extension sockets ?

In a correctly wired system , the extension sockets are wired from the faceplate on the master socket, but as has been mentioned previously , there is only one cable going to the 'master' socket.

Looks like you've almost certainly got some form of 'star' wiring , which is very likely affecting your speed.

@MisterW There is only one cable going to the master socket and that is the white cable from the outside Telegraph Pole.

The cabled going from the master socket goes to the extension via that faceplate adaptor interface cable (see photo). Note two cables, one in from service provider and one out to daisy chain extensions.

The photo of the extension box is correct for all three boxes, but the last one (that was photographed), is the end of the daisy chain and does not have an extension lead and interface, because it is the end.

Master socket, with extension plugged in to face plate.

Re: 35 years to discover a faulty wired Master socket

MisterW — Thu, 09 Jul 2020 15:24:47 GMT

@Leapy So let me get this straight🙄

The incoming line is wired to the back of the faceplate on the 'master' socket, the extension wiring is wired to an adapter which is plugged in to the front of the faceplate.

Why would anyone do that ?. The incoming line should be wired to the A & B terminals on the master socket backplate, the extension wiring is wired to the faceplate, no adapter required !!

Unless , the master socket was faulty in some way and the A & B terminals didn't work?.

Anyway, do you normally plug the router into the master socket ? If you do, then I'd suggest replacing the whole kit and kaboodle with a NTE5C and Mk4 filtered faceplate.

Re: 35 years to discover a faulty wired Master socket

Leapy — Thu, 09 Jul 2020 15:37:15 GMT

@MisterW I think you have it as to why they would do that, I've no idea.

In my last home, they had rewired using black rubber hosepipe as conduit! Why indeed. It took me ages to find out what all the black dust was!

I was asked for a photo of the inside of the small in/out junction box, where the black cable meets the white, so I'm adding that now....is that all OK?

Re: 35 years to discover a faulty wired Master socket

Leapy — Thu, 09 Jul 2020 15:43:25 GMT

@MisterW wrote:

...Anyway, do you normally plug the router into the master socket ? If you do, then I'd suggest replacing the whole kit and kaboodle with a NTE5C and Mk4 filtered faceplate.

No I don't normally use the master socket, its't just a bypass to an extension.

Re: 35 years to discover a faulty wired Master socket

MisterW — Thu, 09 Jul 2020 15:51:18 GMT

@Leapy well whoever did the wiring seems to have a complete aversion to screw terminals🙄 It couldn't possibly have been done by an, even bad, BT engineer.

In that junction box , the incoming wire is MEANT to be connected to the A & B screw terminals and only the outgoing one to the IDC connector!!. Logically it's wired correctly, although you may not be getting a very good connection as the (black covered) wire used for the incoming line is not designed for IDC connectors.

However, I wouldn't go disturbing anything in there!

I honestly think you need to get a BT engineer in to sort the mess out. If your speeds aren't meeting the minimum gauranteed from your estimate then raise a fault. PN should get BT in to fix, although it may take some time in the current circumstances.

However , the engineer is likely to replace the master socket with a filtered one, which means your router will need to be plugged in there. Hence my earlier question ?

Re: 35 years to discover a faulty wired Master socket

tinytaco — Thu, 09 Jul 2020 16:05:36 GMT

Hi there @Leapy It looks like it is an old Telewest socket that has been rerouted to our Suppliers services.

Together with our network partners at Openreach we are prioritising customers who don’t have a phone line or broadband connection, meaning there might be a delay in Speed Faults being fixed. In the meantime, please raise your speed fault online at faults.plus.net.

Re: 35 years to discover a faulty wired Master socket

Leapy — Thu, 09 Jul 2020 16:30:27 GMT

@MisterW Thanks😀 it's some form of cold-comfort to think it has been done by a lazy, but competent BT person and not a total cowboy.

Thankfully it's all working, to a fashion, so I'm reluctant to mess with anything and hope, one day an Engineer will fix the problem or someone will throw a switch and I will be flying.

@tinytaco this discovery, of the problem, was only due to raising a fault and being asked to do a test, using the test socket....hence my amazement at not having one to test! Ironically, my speeds were better 11 months ago, when I was just on fibre and not fibre Extra as Extra, seems to mean less for more. Maybe I just need a reset, if such a thing exists?