topic Re: Settings for relay.plus.net in Email

Settings for relay.plus.net

fr333zin — Wed, 24 Jan 2024 11:13:02 GMT

I'd appreciate some help with Thunderbird email settings for relay.plus.net please

I use Thunderbird v115.7 on a Win 11 PC sometimes. Today I've been unable to send email via relay.plus.net. I can receive email, just can't send.

I get this error message "The Outgoing server (SMTP) relay.plus.net does not seem to support encrypted passwords. If you just set up the account, try changing the 'Authentication method in 'Account settings Outgoing server (SMTP)' to 'Normal password'."

Mobile devices using iOS are able to receive/send email from the same account successfully. I can access webmail and receive/send. It isn't a new account - I've been with Plusnet since the demise of Freeserve and this is a spangly highspeed fibre connection. The PC isn't on a VPN, was built in 2020 to play Borderlands 3.

Current Settings:

SMTP Server Name = relay.plus.net

Port = 587

Connection security = STARTTLS (have also tried SSL/TLS in desperation)

Authentication method = Encrypted password (have also tried Normal password, No password, with other error messages)

User Name = nnnnnnn@plus.com (obvs I use the real one not nnnnnn)

To the best of my ability these match the guidance published by Plusnet and Mozilla and I do have the correct password in Thunderbird - please, where am I going wrong?

Re: Settings for relay.plus.net

MisterW — Wed, 24 Jan 2024 11:28:12 GMT

Authentication method = Encrypted password (have also tried Normal password, No password, with other error messages)

User Name = nnnnnnn@plus.com (obvs I use the real one not nnnnnn)

@fr333zin that's not correct.

Authentication method should be 'Normal password'

Username can be one of two options

1) Your Plusnet <accountname> ( without any @plus.com ) and the password would then be the main account password ( the one used to access the member centre (https://www.plus.net/member-centre/login)

2) If you have additional mailboxes , then <accountname>+<mailboxname> and the password would then be the mailbox password e.g for an account xxxxx with mailbox yyyyy it would be xxxxx+yyyyy

NB the + character is required

Hope that helps

Re: Settings for relay.plus.net

fr333zin — Wed, 24 Jan 2024 12:19:35 GMT

@MisterW thanks for very quick response. I made corrections as suggested, however now I get a different error message

'An error occurred while sending mail. The mail server responded: <anonymous@[192.168.0.19]> sender rejected - invalid domain (no MX or A record). Please verify that your email address is correct in your account settings and try again.'

There's only one email address set up on this PC.

I'd really appreciate any further pointers, please

Re: Settings for relay.plus.net

MisterW — Wed, 24 Jan 2024 12:25:43 GMT

Please verify that your email address is correct in your account settings and try again.

@fr333zin as it says, looks like you havent got a valid email address for the Default Identity in the account settings. Right click on the account in Thunderbird and select Settings. Check that you have the correct sending email adddress , it will look something like xxx@<account>.plus.com

Re: Settings for relay.plus.net

fr333zin — Wed, 24 Jan 2024 13:25:35 GMT

@MisterW thanks, I agree that is the implication, however to confirm the settings I'd made in Default Identity and have just reviewed again are

Account Name = <myaccount>

Your Name = <my name>

Email address = xxx@<myaccount>.plus.com

Still get the same error message sorry

Re: Settings for relay.plus.net

Townman — Wed, 24 Jan 2024 14:24:59 GMT

Your logon details MUST be correct or you would not be able to access the inbox.

Therefore the issue must be specific to SMTP which has a host of other security measures which can give rise to dumb email clients suggesting a username / password error for every failure to connect.

Are you connecting over your Plusnet ISP broadband?

Are you using a VPN?

If you are on the Plusnet network, not using a VPN you should be able to connect to the SMTP server without a user name or password.

Certainly in the first instance try to get this working with username and password but WITHOUT encryption. The settings should look something like...

However... "The mail server responded: <anonymous@[192.168.0.19]>"

Is that EXACLY what the message said, or have you redacted the domain name (and replaced it with the local IP address)?

Having tired to send an email using a non-existent identity, I received the following in webmail...

SMTP Error (550): Failed to set sender "fredrick@somewherenowhereexists.cn" (<fredrick@somewherenowhereexists.cn> sender rejected - invalid domain (no MX or A record)).

That would suggest an error on the righthand side of the @ in your email client configuration. With no placeholder symbols, it should look like...

you@youraccount.plus.com

Two common mistakes are

you@youraccount.plusnet.com

you@youraccount.plus.net

Re: Settings for relay.plus.net

fr333zin — Wed, 24 Jan 2024 14:45:47 GMT

@Townman thankyou, all was working until recently. Agree this is SMTP specific and is a setting in Thunderbird or Win 11 on this PC. Yes the Plusnet fibre connection. No, not on a VPN.

Thunderbird v115 has different menu for Server Settings and Outgoing Server. The Outgoing server does not have the checkbox option to use the same settings as the incoming mail server.

Re: Settings for relay.plus.net

Townman — Wed, 24 Jan 2024 14:54:18 GMT

@fr333zin

If the above does not get you going, give me a nudge and I'll point you at the SMTP diagnostic method ... though I suspect that you are now logging on to the SMTP server successfully.

Re: Settings for relay.plus.net

fr333zin — Wed, 24 Jan 2024 14:56:49 GMT

Take 2:

Yes that's exactly what the error message says. Weird. For interest pinging 192.168.0.19 gets no response. The PC is on DHCP.

Yes I have tried deleting the whole <myname>@<myaccount>.plus.com entry and re-entering it, however still get the same error.

Thanks for looking at this

Re: Settings for relay.plus.net

fr333zin — Wed, 24 Jan 2024 14:58:39 GMT

@Townman nudge, have not managed to log on to SMTP

Re: Settings for relay.plus.net

Townman — Wed, 24 Jan 2024 15:38:02 GMT

Ok try the following...

Test SMTP authentication

Email programs often report username / password error for issues not actually related to those being wrong, but for other connectivity issues. Such can be very frustrating when you are convinced that they are correct. Testing SMTP authentication through a command line interface can deliver a more precise error message. The following describes how to do this using TELNET.

This is not difficult, but you need the following resources which might be unfamiliar...

TELNET - this might need installing as an additional option, for Windows see enabling TELNET.
A code64 encoder / decoder such as this.

You can use TELNET to communicate direct with the SMTP server as follows...

Open the code64 encoder in a web browser and leave ready for use in the following steps.

Launch a windows command line window (DOS window) - press windows-key+R - type CMD into the run box - click OK

Enter...

telnet relay.plus.net 587

Press enter. Note if you use one of the other brand email services, use the appropriate SMTP server name for that brand. In response to SMTP server I'm here message, say 'HELLO'...

EHLO relay.plus.net

The SMTP server will then report what it can do after which tell the server you wish to authenticate...

AUTH login

The server should return the following, which is a base64 encoded string that requires your username:

334 VXNlcm5hbWU6

Use the code64 encoder to encode your username and paste it into the telnet window and press enter. For example:

bXl1c2VybmFtZQ==

The server should return the following, which is a base64 encoded string that requires your password:

334 UGFzc3dvcmQ6

Paste the base64 encoded password for the username. For example:

bXlwYXNzd29yZA==

The server will then report success or failure, any failure message should clearly indicate the reason for the failure. If the reason for the failure is not clear, please report back the message.

Close the SMTP / TELNET session by entering

quit

The session should look something similar to the below wherein your input is in bold...

220 avasout03 smtp relay.plus.net
EHLO relay.plus.net
250-avasout03 hello [your IP address], pleased to meet you
250-HELP
250-AUTH LOGIN PLAIN
250-SIZE 104857600
250-PIPELINING
250-8BITMIME
250-STARTTLS
250 OK
AUTH LOGIN
334 VXNlcm5hbWU6
bXl1c2VybmFtZQ==
334 UGFzc3dvcmQ6
bXlwYXNzd29yZA==
235 ... authentication succeeded
quit
221 avasout03 smtp closing connection
Connection to host lost.

Here are some examples of failure responses...

535 ...authentication rejected [as username / password is wrong]
535 ...authentication rejected as source IP has a poor reputation
535 Too many SMTP auth failures. Please try again later.

Re: Settings for relay.plus.net

fr333zin — Mon, 29 Jan 2024 09:39:12 GMT

@Townman Thanks for this. I was able to follow the instructions you sent this morning. The response I get is '535 Too Many SMTP auth failures. Please try again later.'

So I will work through changing passwords, really grateful for your help please say if I've misunderstood anything!

Re: Settings for relay.plus.net

Townman — Mon, 29 Jan 2024 13:31:40 GMT

You are going to need to sit and wait.

You have had far too many failed connection attempts. It does not matter now if you have the credentials right or not - until the timeout (whatever that might be) has expired you WILL NOT be able to connect to the SMTP server.

How long you wait is indeterminate. You might be able to gain some control over this IF you can get a different IP address allocated to your line. If you do not have a fixed IP address, you might be able to 'ditch' your sticky dynamic address by turning off your router for at least 90 minutes.

Check your current IP address using whatsmyip
Turn the router off for at least 90 minutes
Turn it back on
Check your IP address using whatsmyip
If it is different try to connect to the SMTP server again - if it is the same AND you get the same failure - try again

Re: Settings for relay.plus.net

fr333zin — Mon, 29 Jan 2024 13:47:42 GMT

Thanks @Townman I will try that later. I guess I need to say that it's not me jackhammering the account.

Re: Settings for relay.plus.net

Townman — Mon, 29 Jan 2024 13:55:40 GMT

Ah now you have rung an alarm bell ...

@MisterW - can you recall, is this condition related to the account or the connecting IP? I thought the latter ... @fr333zin 's observation might infer the account.

Certainly after repeated credentials failure, the service does go into self protection mode and even correct credentials will be rejected. One way of testing this might be to attempt to connect to the account on a mobile device NOT connecting over the Plusnet WiFi. If you cannot get in, then the self protection applies to the account.

There is indeed some risk that another party is trying to hack the account.

Re: Settings for relay.plus.net

MisterW — Mon, 29 Jan 2024 15:32:20 GMT

@Townman can you recall, is this condition related to the account or the connecting IP?

Im not sure TBH but i think its the account ...