topic Re: Use of quotes in Community Site Feedback

Use of quotes

coastergrotto — Sat, 01 Nov 2008 12:12:57 GMT

The following rule applies to the use of quotes.
Only quote the full content of a post if :-
a) it is NOT the post immediately before your reply
b) You find that your reply has been forced onto a new page (then edit in the full quote if it's needed.)
Is this rule really necessary? I can appreciate it being annoying if the previous post is a long one, but surely not if it is only a couple of lines long. Part quotes of the previous post are permitted, but if the previous post is only one sentence long it may not be possible to shorten it without losing it's meaning.
If it's permitted to use the full quote once someone has already responded why not in the first reply?
I really feel this rule is somewhat pedantic and unnecessary and as should be removed, or at least, amended.

Re: Use of quotes

jelv — Sat, 01 Nov 2008 12:21:03 GMT

@coastergrotto
I agree with the rule as it stands. I can't understand why it is necessary to quote the preceding post (unless your post is on a new page).
If you need to make it clear that your post is a specific reply to the points in the previous post you can do as I've done, or prefix your post with something like "Re: <Reply #13>"

Re: Use of quotes

mal0z — Sat, 01 Nov 2008 12:22:23 GMT

I totally agree that medium to long posts should be edited before being quoted, but maybe amended to add a rule to allow for full quote if original is only a few lines long - say up to four lines ??.

Re: Use of quotes

gswindale — Sat, 01 Nov 2008 12:26:40 GMT

But if you're replying to the preceeding post, is there any need to quote it?

Re: Use of quotes

mal0z — Sat, 01 Nov 2008 12:34:18 GMT

Probably not - certainly not if it is still on the screen of the average monitor. occasionaly though people may hit the wrong button by mistake.
We don't want to be too pedantic though.

Re: Use of quotes

jelv — Sat, 01 Nov 2008 12:50:22 GMT

Having a rule based on a number of lines could be a source of arguments. How many lines the preceding post takes will depend on the screen resolution - someone may be viewing a post on a 1680x1050 monitor and it's only three lines so they quote it, someone else views it on a 1024 by 768 (and they may be using larger fonts) and it's five or six lines - so they complain. Don't forget also that when you quote it gets put in a slightly narrower box so it may take more lines than the original post - would the rule apply to the original post or the post with the quote.
Nope, it all gets messy. Far better to stick to the simple unambiguous rule we have at present.

Re: Use of quotes

jelv — Sat, 01 Nov 2008 12:53:37 GMT

... and do you include blank lines between paragraphs in the count?
For example this post.
Is it three lines or five?

Re: Use of quotes

coastergrotto — Sat, 01 Nov 2008 13:06:45 GMT

How many members are aware of the rule? Maybe frequent posters but certainly not newbies. How many members read the rules anyway?

I wasn't aware of it until I had a quote deleted and I felt it was a quite unnecessary intervention and it did annoy me at the time as I felt I had been punished for a misdemeanour. Come on it's only a forum not a prison camp. How many times does it happen, anyway? Surely not enough to make such a petty rule about it.

Re: Use of quotes

jelv — Sat, 01 Nov 2008 13:13:16 GMT

I think the question is how often would it happen if the rule wasn't there!

Re: Use of quotes

mal0z — Sat, 01 Nov 2008 13:19:13 GMT

@coastergrotto
Far question - if you open the forums - the rules / guidlines aren't that obvious - so I think you are right - many people probably haven't read them.
I certainly missed them - and I've been using newsgroups and forums for years.
I do agree there have been instances where forum moderators have been rather too zealous - but they do a diificult job , so it's not easy.

Re: Use of quotes

coastergrotto — Sat, 01 Nov 2008 13:30:47 GMT

@jelv:
Very little I would hazard to guess as many people aren't aware of the rule. Even if it did, is it really so important? It's a very petty and unecessary rule IMHO.

Re: Use of quotes

jelv — Sat, 01 Nov 2008 13:36:37 GMT

Perhaps newly registered users should be taken to the rules immediately they join:
http://custom.simplemachines.org/mods/index.php?mod=1446

Re: Use of quotes

mal0z — Sat, 01 Nov 2008 13:44:20 GMT

Fair comments - but it's not just first time posters that do it - we are all human have lapses of memory - and sometimes the worst offenders are regulars - I've tripped up once or twice and Chilly moderated
If you look at the home page here http://community.plus.net/forum/ - I can see no reference to user guidlines at all

Re: Use of quotes

chillypenguin — Sat, 01 Nov 2008 13:45:31 GMT

As others have said, there is no need to quote the full preceding post. All it does is lengthen the page and you end up reading the same think twice.
You only have to read some other forums that don't have this rule and it can become very annoying, at least IMHO.
It is the most breached forum rule, but does that in itself mean that it should be relaxed?
Perhaps where the proceeding post is only one line, there is a case for leaving it. But we like to keep the rules as simple as possible.
Personally I would remove the `quote` link from the last post, as its more prominent that the `Reply` link. And I think this is where less experienced uses fall foul.

Quote from: coastergrotto
I wasn't aware of it until I had a quote deleted and I felt it was a quite unnecessary intervention and it did annoy me at the time as I felt I had been punished for a misdemeanour.

I am sorry its not our intention to annoy you.

Re: Use of quotes

chillypenguin — Sat, 01 Nov 2008 13:47:52 GMT

Quote from: mal0z
If you look at the home page here http://community.plus.net/forum/ - I can see no reference to user guidlines at all

They are in the Community Support board. link:rules

Re: Use of quotes

pierre_pierre — Sat, 01 Nov 2008 13:57:54 GMT

one of the main reasons that posters are not aware of it, is that when the Moderators remove the quote, the person who has had it removed is probably unaware if he uses the "unread posts" button to get to the answers, he then doesnt see that he has been censored and the quote removed.
Mods do say that the offending person does get told, but I have no evidence of this, so the bad offender never knows
Using other forums where they dont seem to care drives me mad, it takes more time to read the quotes before you get to the meat of the reply

Re: Use of quotes

mal0z — Sat, 01 Nov 2008 14:00:56 GMT

I nearly always use the "Unread posts" button, so I agree.
And I too have not seen evidence of a PM if a mod changed one of my posts.

Re: Use of quotes

chillypenguin — Sat, 01 Nov 2008 14:08:14 GMT

We don't tend PM people for quoting the preceding post, most users soon spot it. But as Peter says this can mean that the user does not see it straight away.
On the subject of spotting it, anyone spotted coastergrotto post that has had a quote removed, as I can not find it!

Re: Use of quotes

198kHz — Sat, 01 Nov 2008 14:12:53 GMT

My initial reaction was to fully agree with the OP; however I've now been persuaded that the present rules should remain. I would say, though, that thinking back to when I signed up to the Community, I don't recall the Forum Rules being prominently brought to my attentiion.

Re: Use of quotes

pierre_pierre — Sat, 01 Nov 2008 14:17:17 GMT

long, long time ago

Quote
203 Products and Services Discussion / Community Support / Re: is anti spam working? on: 21/12/2007, 12:11
Let's just hope you are right!!
Moderators note by James_H : Removed full quote of previous post, it is not needed. : Forum Rules