topic Re: New user post visibility problems in Community Site Feedback

New user post visibility problems

Townman — Tue, 08 Aug 2017 11:43:06 GMT

I've become aware of long delays between knowing a new user has made a post and that post becoming available to read.

The scenario is typically, I receive notification of a new post on a topic I'm subscribed to, but when I look the post is not there. If I look at the member's details that reports a number of posts but goes not list them.

I know this is down to the spam prevention interlocks, however I'm wondering if the essentials that a user has to do to become a full member, are adequately communicated? For example that email address verification is essential BEFORE posts will be published?

There's nothing worse than thingking your request for help has been published when it has not ... and you're desperate for a solution.

Re: New user post visibility problems

Mav — Tue, 08 Aug 2017 11:51:48 GMT

I have noticed lately that I get the notification pop-up yet it doesn't appear in the New Posts list for a while (minutes not hours) although it does appear in the Notifications list immediately.

As for email verification I am not sure that plays a major part as, from my observations, most of these above are either regular posters or the poster's email had already been verified.

Re: New user post visibility problems

jaread83 — Tue, 08 Aug 2017 12:41:58 GMT

There is a bug that is being investigated by Lithium where users to a subscribed topic/board will receive notification from posts from users who have not verified their email. As you know, the post isn't displayed until the email is verified.

In my bug report I have asked that Lithium considers holding off on any notifications and email until the email is verified (similar to when blog moderators approve blog comments).

Re: New user post visibility problems

Townman — Tue, 08 Aug 2017 13:07:25 GMT

Hi Jack,
In terms of managing the new user's expectations do you believe the information made available is sufficiently clear as to advise that no posting will be publicly visible until AFTER they have completed the email verification step?

Fixing the Lithium bug will remove the premature notifications of the posting, but it will not get the user's question made visible any quicker, which from a customer service perspective I would have thought to be of a greater concern?

Re: New user post visibility problems

MauriceC — Tue, 08 Aug 2017 15:11:42 GMT

@Mav wrote:

I have noticed lately that I get the notification pop-up yet it doesn't appear in the New Posts list for a while (minutes not hours) although it does appear in the Notifications list immediately.

I've also seen this happen a few times in recent weeks. To add to the confusion, if you do click on the 'pop up' it cannot find the post yet the Notification count has been updated! Going via the notification link, the post can be found. Timing?

Note in the two instances I can recall the posts were from established users.

Re: New user post visibility problems

jaread83 — Tue, 08 Aug 2017 15:19:08 GMT

Users who have not verified their email will see a blue banner posting notifying them that the post will not be visible until verified. They also will see a banner after registering that notifies them that posts will not be visible until email has been verified.

Myself and Louisa are looking at ways of introducing onboarding for new users to help them get started with the basics of using the forums so I will likely include a little bit more prominence on the visibility of posts before verifying an email if it isn't entirely clear from the point of account creation.

Re: New user post visibility problems

Townman — Tue, 08 Aug 2017 15:23:38 GMT

MauriceC wrote.

Going via the notification link, the post can be found. Timing?

In my experience clicking the notification link takes you to the TOPIC not the POST - which is not there.

Re: New user post visibility problems

jaread83 — Tue, 08 Aug 2017 15:27:33 GMT

This is correct. You will receive the notification linking to the new post on your subscribed topic/board but when visiting it.. if it can't find the post it will default to the OP of the topic. Later on, the user may have verified their email by that point so then you can actually see the post that was previously hidden. As I said earlier, this is a bug that I have already raised with Lithium to fix as I don't think anyone should be notified of a post by an unverified account due to the post not actually being visible.

Re: New user post visibility problems

Townman — Tue, 08 Aug 2017 15:32:31 GMT

@jaread83 wrote:

Users who have not verified their email will see a blue banner posting notifying them that the post will not be visible until verified. They also will see a banner after registering that notifies them that posts will not be visible until email has been verified.

@jaread83,

Thank you for the clarification and detailed information ... its not something visible to we old lags, less we go create additional accounts ... which would not exactly be "cricket".

Is the "blue" the usual after post pale blue banner similar to that after every post? Personally I find the text contrast low and rather treat that banner to be information rather than a warning. Is there room within house style / technology capability to post that as a warning in a different colour in the context of the subject under discussion please?

Thanks, Kevin

Re: New user post visibility problems

jaread83 — Tue, 08 Aug 2017 15:36:04 GMT

I can't change the type of message (alert, error, etc) but can certainly look into the colour contrast when I have some time. I assume its a blue banner... it could be red... haven't created a new account and posted without verifying my email in a long time.

Re: New user post visibility problems

Townman — Tue, 08 Aug 2017 16:15:35 GMT

@jaread83 wrote:
As I said earlier, this is a bug that I have already raised with Lithium to fix as I don't think anyone should be notified of a post by an unverified account due to the post not actually being visible.

For the avoidance of doubt or misunderstanding - I completely agree - there are though herein two distinct issues ... the bug illuminating the real local concern of enabling users to more readily access help...

If a new user just happens to hit a subscribed to thread we old lags hit a minor irritation of being told there's a post we cannot see - that does not phase me - being pointed to a not-yet-visible post is (for me) not the issue here
Given the stretches of time I have seen between having seen the notification and being able to see the post (sometimes days) I am concerned that NEW users might post a request for help and believe its immediately visible and not bother to verify their email address as that is not part of their login identity ... then wait for a good while in frustration from not receiving the help they seek

On other forums I have used, one is not allowed to post at all until having verified the email address - in other words when you have verified your email address you can then post and those posts are immediately visible. Can Lithium be configured to work in this manner? If yes, is this a mode of working which would be acceptable here?

Note on many forums, the login ID is the email address so email verification is part of the registration activity - right on the front edge of the join-up process.

Whilst I know you are very busy how easy would it be to query the system to monitor the numbers of users who have signed up but have not verified their email address within 6 / 12 / 24 / 48 or above hours? Can the system offer a profile of sign-up to email verification intervals please? Least that gives us some facts to inform how much of a problem this is as opposed to an observation that it happens.

Re: New user post visibility problems

jaread83 — Tue, 08 Aug 2017 16:10:00 GMT

There is an option in the admin panel for users that are not authenticated but I don't think it is working as expected or that the option is ambiguous in its language and I have got the wrong end of the stick on what it does.

I have sent a support ticket to ask what the option does and why isn't it working as expected (its currently set to 'Authenticate users before they can write their post').

Re: New user post visibility problems

Townman — Wed, 09 Aug 2017 11:35:00 GMT

@jaread83,

Hi Jack,

In the arena of notification bugs, may I draw this to your attention ... rather than starting another topic ... as the issue could be related to the premature notification issue.

This morning I received a notification that two people had posted to one of my subscribed topics, but the topic had no new posts shown. When I checked the first user matched the profile described above, so known problem, move on.

On checking the second user, their profile showed that they have made just one post, which is visible, but is not related tot the topic I was notified on.User profile

Notification Feed

No idea what is actually happening here, however I wonder if SPAM filtering has any bearing here? Is it possible that a post held by the spam filter does not add to the user's post count (different to happens for pre-verification posts), but still gives rise to a notification?

Re: New user post visibility problems

Mav — Wed, 09 Aug 2017 12:59:07 GMT

@Townman

I think I know what has happened with purplesage's post:

He/she has, indeed, only made one post which is in the thread 'Mail going to Recipient's Spam Folder ' as per the profile. But the title of this thread had been changed from 'Plusnet support contact email address ' which is what you seem to have listed in your notifications list.

Not sure why this happens and seem to remember it being discussed soon after launch.

Re: New user post visibility problems

Townman — Wed, 09 Aug 2017 13:25:20 GMT

@Mav,

Would you recall if this was a post split and retitle? Which might well fit the observed events.

Re: New user post visibility problems

Mav — Wed, 09 Aug 2017 13:29:50 GMT

Yes, it had been split then the title changed.

To be honest I not sure the split makes a difference I think it is just a title change that causes this. Maybe @jaread83 can shed more light.

Re: New user post visibility problems

jaread83 — Wed, 09 Aug 2017 13:46:11 GMT

I don't think the split is the problem here but I could be wrong. We sometime can see that sometimes posts hang about in a limbo like state for a short amount of time before being visible. I am assuming that this could be the spam filter as it can be quite hard on newly registers users on the first post (from what I have observed anyway).
I am in contact with a Lithium support dev about the receiving of notifications from unverified accounts, hoping to see what they say and escalate this to the product devs to squash a potential bug.

Re: New user post visibility problems

Townman — Wed, 09 Aug 2017 13:49:24 GMT

@Mav,

Thanks that would explain everything!!

Now I have gone and looked at the actual post I can see the thumb print of a mod ... advising they had just done that.

GUILTY: of seeing something which looked a bit similar to an issue under discussion ... and thinking it was another manifestation. Sorry!

Re: New user post visibility problems

jaread83 — Wed, 09 Aug 2017 14:20:14 GMT

I am guessing you all received a notification of a test account posting on this board? I just needed to get some screenshots to send over to Lithium to prove that unverified users can post and subscribers would get notified of it.

Re: New user post visibility problems

Mav — Wed, 09 Aug 2017 14:21:15 GMT

@jaread83

I did, indeed.