topic Re: Router connection dropouts in Broadband

Router connection dropouts

82sg — Mon, 03 Mar 2025 17:28:17 GMT

Hi,

I’ve been with Plusnet for a couple of years now and never really had any problems with connectivity until recently. Perhaps about a month or so ago, the router started to reset its connection every few hours. It got so bad that I logged a fault and Plusnet organised for an Openreach engineer to have a look. They let me know that they repaired some cabling at the cabinet, and it has made a difference in that the resets have reduced in frequency to maybe 1 or 2 a day, but this is still a nuisance. The remote tests apparently don’t show any problems and I’ve tried all the usual steps of reboots, checking the cabling from the master socket to the router etc.

I’ve also now started to notice that the reported downstream speed will occasionally drop from 40mbps, which is what it usually was previously, to around 30mbps.

I’m wondering if there’s anything else I should be trying? If anybody has any suggestions I’d be very grateful.

Thanks.

Re: Router connection dropouts

jab1 — Mon, 03 Mar 2025 17:32:22 GMT

@82sg As PN say there 'isn't a problem', then we need to do a bit of self-investigation. I assume you are on FTTC, using a Hub2? Do you still have a phone service?

Re: Router connection dropouts

82sg — Mon, 03 Mar 2025 18:45:33 GMT

Hi John, thanks for the reply. I don’t have a phone service anymore.

Re: Router connection dropouts

jab1 — Mon, 03 Mar 2025 18:55:29 GMT

OK - not a problem.

For Community members to be able to help, information from these sites, as screenshots, posted as pictures within the topic, not as attachments:-

BT Broadband Availability Checker (obscuring your phone number), where a landline phone is no longer supplied or known use the address version BT Broadband Address Availability (obscuring your address)

BTW Performance Tester - Over a wired (Ethernet) connection if at all possible, please report the 'ADDITIONAL DIAGNOSTICS'- if it will run. This test is recommended to be performed with only one device connected.

Sight of the broadband connection status from your Hub (with the 'Username' obscured) would also be of help.

For the Hub One -

Navigate from the Home Screen to Troubleshooting > Helpdesk

For the Hub Two -

Navigate from the Home Screen to Advanced Settings > Technical Log > Information

Where the phone line is still active, it may also be a good idea to report the results of a Quiet Line Test - dial 17070 option 2 from a (preferably corded) phone. After the confirmation of your phone number, there should be total silence apart from the regular 'Quiet Line Test' announcement. Any other noise - report a PHONE fault first.

If you are unsure about any of the above, please just ask - I am happy to help.

Please DO NOT reboot/restart the router.

Re: Router connection dropouts

jab1 — Mon, 03 Mar 2025 19:24:25 GMT

@82sg In addition to the above - when you 'lose connection' does your Hub light change colour?

Assuming you have a Hub2, can you please attach the error log to a post - navigate to the page in the screen shot below, and click the 'export' button.

Re: Router connection dropouts

82sg — Mon, 03 Mar 2025 23:23:43 GMT

Hi John,

Thanks for the suggestions, unfortunately I can’t reach the BT test site, it appears to be down. The hub light changes to orange I believe. I’ve attached the error log as requested.

Many thanks,

Gary.

Re: Router connection dropouts

jab1 — Tue, 04 Mar 2025 07:20:57 GMT

@82sg Thanks for the event log. From that, I think it is safe to say you are having too many DSL drops for it to be claimed you are 'running normally'. Personally, I would go back to PN and ask them to carry out some more checks. I appreciate you have said previously that you have done reboots/checked cabling etc, which obviously will give rise to some of the drops, but very recent behaviour still suggests there is something not quite right.

Before you do go back to PN, though, can you post your 'Technical Log - Information' screen, so we can see your connection status - obscure your user name in it.

Re: Router connection dropouts

outcast — Tue, 04 Mar 2025 07:47:20 GMT

@jab1 wrote:

BTW Performance Tester - Over a wired (Ethernet) connection if at all possible, please report the 'ADDITIONAL DIAGNOSTICS'- if it will run. This test is recommended to be performed with only one device connected.

@jab1 is it worth removing the above lines from your cut and paste text, now that the BTW test is permanently retired ?

In my opinion, if you wanted to quote a alternative test, my suggestion would be https://www.waveform.com/tools/bufferbloat as the included latency test is a great indicator to show whether the tested connection has upload bandwidth problems, or is running some unexpected cloud backup or torrent sharing - which most other speed testers don't reveal.

Re: Router connection dropouts

jab1 — Tue, 04 Mar 2025 07:50:43 GMT

Good point @outcast - I shall amend my script accordingly at some point today - although the number of times it needs quoting is reducing as more and more move to FTTP.

Re: Router connection dropouts

Dan_the_Van — Tue, 04 Mar 2025 08:31:11 GMT

@outcast

Bufferboat tests on a Hub Two is not advised as the reported results would be misleading as the result is always poor with no option on the Hub to improve anything

Re: Router connection dropouts

jab1 — Tue, 04 Mar 2025 08:36:40 GMT

I was thinking about that @Dan_the_Van . For speed testing purposes, I shall probably substitute the Ookla test.

Re: Router connection dropouts

outcast — Tue, 04 Mar 2025 09:01:40 GMT

@jab1 yes I agree with your FTTP point, however I've twice had to walk through people with newly upgraded 300Mb FTTP using NON-Plusnet routers because their upload path was showing spikes of excessive latency, and used the waveform test to help them apply QoS and optimise their latency and bandwidth with their third party router.

Using the waveform test early in diagnosing any line problems, seeing a "Bufferbloat Grade" of "F" is an immediate red flag !

The waveform result is also a good indicator to distinguish whether we're looking at an ADSL line, or a very slow FTTC/SoGEA problem - especially when the customer doesn't understand the terminology.

And finally, as more people migrate their Plusnet landline phone numbers to VoIP in 2025 as the PSTN switch off progresses, I think we're going to see an increase in problems here with people reporting issues with poor VoIP call quality or call dropouts, as the Plusnet Hub2 doesn't appear to support the prioritisation of VoIP packets on slow DSL lines - so again the waveform bufferbloat score, or the upload active latency result, is a quick thing to check in this situation.

IF you choose to take my suggestion of using the waveform test in your cut and paste text, can you make your instructions clear that the customer needs to paste the result URL in their forum reply, rather than quoting individual speed or latency numbers, because using the URL ensures that we see a complete picture of what is going on.

Suggested steps -

Ensure that the internet connection isn't being used for anything else, such as downloading or streaming etc.
Browse to the test at https://www.waveform.com/tools/bufferbloat
Click on the [Start Test] button, and let the test run.
When the test completes, find "Share Your Results:" at the bottom of the results panel.
On that same line, click on the [Copy] button to grab the test result URL.
In the Plusnet forum reply editor, click on the 'Insert/edit link' icon (the chain symbol at the top)
In the pop-up 'Insert Link' window, paste the test result URL in to the 'URL' box at the top, then click on [Ok] button.
Finally, click on the forum editor's [Post] button.

Re: Router connection dropouts

outcast — Tue, 04 Mar 2025 09:32:07 GMT

@jab1 wrote:

For speed testing purposes, I shall probably substitute the Ookla test.

For me, the Ookla test consistently gives me random and misleading results, because for me being near London, the Ookla's algorithm for automatically choosing which test server to use, more often than not will pick one of several London servers with low latency but with insufficient bandwidth to give meaningful results. Therefore Ookla is the test I avoid using.

If you are choosing to do just a simple speed test, then this test is simple and accurate - https://embeddable-speedtest.samknows.com/ .

I also use the ThinkBroadband test - https://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest , as that seems accurate, and the resulting graphs can be useful.

Anyway I'm not trying to tell anyone what to do, I'm just suggesting what I would do.

@jab1 keep up the good work ! 😎

Re: Router connection dropouts

jab1 — Tue, 04 Mar 2025 09:56:35 GMT

Anyway I'm not trying to tell anyone what to do, I'm just suggesting what I would do.

@jab1 keep up the good work ! 😎

.

Fair enough, @outcast . We obviously have different approaches. For me, I like to start off simple, as very many of the original posters, in my experience, are not always that tech savvy, so getting them to do simple things first makes life easier. If we need to get more involved, then I will do so, but you have to recognise that most home users who come on here with problems are easier to help if you keep the replies as simple as possible.

Re: Router connection dropouts

Dan_the_Van — Tue, 04 Mar 2025 10:54:58 GMT

@outcast

For what it is worth performing a buffer bloat test always gives me a result of D on a good day I might get a C.

Over diagnosis of an issue in the first instance should be avoided as it can add a layer of complication that's not required.

Re: Router connection dropouts

outcast — Tue, 04 Mar 2025 11:49:18 GMT

I'm not disagreeing.

@Dan_the_Van wrote:

For what it is worth performing a buffer bloat test always gives me a result of D on a good day I might get a C.

Yes, and knowing that means that if you see a "D" you can assume that it's normal, whereas an "F" is a red flag.

Clearly there are thousands of people using a Hub2 with a "D" score who are perfectly happy, so no need to comment.

My point about the waveform test, is that it captures a snapshot of many relevant metrics in one test, as a diagnostic starting point.

@Dan_the_Van wrote:

Over diagnosis of an issue in the first instance should be avoided as it can add a layer of complication that's not required.

Having the most complete set of metrics in a single test, doesn't mean that you have to react to it, or over diagnose anything.

The waveform test simply gives the maximum amount to data in one simple test, without the user avoiding telling you something. The test itself is no more difficult to run than any others, and provides a convenient and simple URL to reply with - rather than having the user figure out how to do screenshots, upload the image, and post a picture in their reply, etc.

The issue I most often see is something like, someone is complaining that their YouTube is buffering, so you ask them to screenshot a speed test (of both upload and download speeds), but because they think that they have a download speed issue, they repeatedly don't provide the upload result (because they don't think or accept that it's relevant). Whereas getting them to provide the waveform result URL, you can see the upload speed and latency - so are able to point out that the speed test you asked for was done while another user of the home network was uploading something, or a mobile was doing a cloud backup etc, and invalidating the entire test.

The problem with doing one test at a time approach, is that network conditions change between tests, and you never know when the person you are trying to help is now doing the next thing you've asked for, or if they've disappeared for the day (or week) - so you are waiting around for a reply that sometimes never comes. Again, doing the test that provides the most metrics, means that you and I don't waste our time waiting for the next response.

Re: Router connection dropouts

outcast — Tue, 04 Mar 2025 12:00:11 GMT

As this thread has got somewhat sidetracked and off topic, I'm reposting the last relevant post for @82sg to respond to -

@jab1 wrote:

@82sg Thanks for the event log. From that, I think it is safe to say you are having too many DSL drops for it to be claimed you are 'running normally'. Personally, I would go back to PN and ask them to carry out some more checks. I appreciate you have said previously that you have done reboots/checked cabling etc, which obviously will give rise to some of the drops, but very recent behaviour still suggests there is something not quite right.

Before you do go back to PN, though, can you post your 'Technical Log - Information' screen, so we can see your connection status - obscure your user name in it.

Re: Router connection dropouts

82sg — Tue, 04 Mar 2025 20:19:20 GMT

Hi,

Sorry for the late reply, it’s been a hectic day. Thanks to everyone for the suggestions too. Here is a screenshot of the technical log. Timing is great as the router just reconnected again.

Re: Router connection dropouts

jab1 — Tue, 04 Mar 2025 20:30:24 GMT

@82sg Looking at that Technical log, I am convinced there is a fault somewhere, despite PN's denials. Your line attenuation suggests you should be getting around 60/65Mb/s connection speed, your SNR margins are not indicating any issues, and yet you are restricted to about half what I would expect you to be getting.

I appreciate it is a pain, but can you give us a another export of your error log, please?

Re: Router connection dropouts

82sg — Tue, 04 Mar 2025 20:39:11 GMT

Hi John,

Not a problem, the latest extract is attached and thanks again for your help. I’ve kicked off the automated help check again so will see what it comes back with this time.

Thanks,

Gary.