topic Pulling my hair out over PlusNet lack of support. in Broadband

Pulling my hair out over PlusNet lack of support.

KitKite — Wed, 20 Mar 2024 14:45:15 GMT

I have tried to get PlusNet to answer my issue below.

All they are interested in is to get my to sign a new contract so they can send be a replacement Router. This does not explain or answer the series of events over the Chrismas weekend.

I believe my lines banded profile got reset to a lower one with an upper DL speed of 6655.

Plusnet do not want to reset my download speed to the pre Christmas weekend. The have basically capped it at 6655.

Can anyone help?

Regards

Please see below:-

1. Before the Christmas weekend 2023 my download speed was approx 7.9 Mbps.

2. For several days (from the start of the Xmas week end, approx 22nd Dec) the download speed was less than 1Mbps.

3. My maximum speed slowly increased (after the Xmas weekend) to no more than 5.7 Mbps over several days and weeks.

4. This time last year I was down loading at a speed 2 Mbps faster than I do now.

Under PlusNet's Broadband Terminology Guide. https://www.plus.net/help/archive/broadband/broadband-terminology-guide/

the Banded Profiles are as follows

2272kb/s - 4544kb/s

3328kb/s - 6656kb/s. <--------

4864kb/s - 9728kb/s. <-------

7168kb/s - 14336kb/s

My Data rate connects at DL 6655kb/s which matches the Banded Profile DL of 3328kb/s - 6656kb/s.

Can you reset my Banded Profile to the next band (which I believe may have been the band I was set at before Christmas 23) 4864kb/s - 9728kb/s. I believe this is the DLM learning process.

Regards

Your Plusnet adviser may ask you for the following information:

1 - Product name: Plusnet Router

2 - Serial number: N7171081B005543

3 - Firmware version: 7.275.17_F2704N_Plusnet

4 - Board version: F@ST2704N

5 - Mode ADSL

6 - Uptime: 0 days 02:11:08

7 - Data rate: 1100/6655

8 - Maximum data rate: 1096/10816

9 - Noise margin: 5.4/11.4

10 - Line attenuation: 22.2/42.5

12 - Data sent/received: 21.9M/101.9M

20 - Broadband username: t

21 - Wi-Fi network/SSID: PLUSNET-TPX7JR

22 - Wi-Fi connections: Enable(802.11 b/g/n(up to 144 Mb/s))20 MHz WPS disabled

23 - Wi-Fi security: WPA2

24 - Wi-Fi channel: 10

25 - Firewall: Default

26 - MAC Address: f4:6b:ef:8d:e7:4b

27 - Software variant Version 1.0

28 - Boot loader: 7.275.6

Third similar reply below.

Hi Thomas, I hope you're having a good week? Speed issues can be frustrating when they happen. I have looked into your issue and there no faults that I have found, but your router is very old. It might be time to look into an upgrade with the Customer Options Team, their direct number is 0800 013 2632. If you prefer, we can arrange a call to discuss this. -[CSA Removed], Sheffield

You sent

This is an identical reply as before. I do not want a new contract. Can you tell be me which banded profile I had before the 15th Dec 2023

Enter

plusnet

Hi Chris, No change has been made on your band or product. You are on the same product. Banding profiles as this is managed automatically by Openreach and it is not something we have control over. A lot of factors could be responsible for the reduced speed but we have not made any change on your product. There is no fault on your line, so it might be a problem with the router. Are you willing to look into this? -[CSA Removed] - Sheffield

Moderator's note by Mike (Mav): CSA name(s) removed (to an area staff can see) as per Forum rules.

Re: Pulling my hair out over PlusNet lack of support.

jab1 — Tue, 19 Mar 2024 21:16:34 GMT

@KitKite What was the date of the Help desk information in your above post? The data on that indicates that you do/did have a problem when it was grabbed - your D/S noise margin is way too high, and unless you have turned the router off, you had DSL drops previously, which will have caused the banding.

To be honest, I would accept the suggestion to get a new Hub - the 2704 is ancient, and could be dying, which MAY explain your errors I mention above.

Re: Pulling my hair out over PlusNet lack of support.

Longliner — Wed, 20 Mar 2024 12:22:30 GMT

Don't you think it's rather unfair to lambast Plusnet just yet? Their suggestion of a new router is just common sense as the 2704 was great for its day but is now well past it, like myself! You've skipped the Hub One and I think you will be pleasantly surprised by the Hub Two.

Re: Pulling my hair out over PlusNet lack of support.

KitKite — Wed, 20 Mar 2024 13:09:10 GMT

The router has been rebooted after the Broadband failure at Christmas. It was left on for several weeks. It increased to a max download of 6655. The max limit of the lower banding is 6655. Is that a coincident?

Also how long should the broadband take to change to the next higher banding profile?

Re: Pulling my hair out over PlusNet lack of support.

jab1 — Wed, 20 Mar 2024 13:16:02 GMT

@KitKite Can you post your current Help Desk?

Re: Pulling my hair out over PlusNet lack of support.

KitKite — Wed, 20 Mar 2024 13:36:37 GMT

Thanks for the reply.

My frustration is that PlusNet has not or avoided making any comment or apology to the system failure in my area at christmas.

My modem is stable at the very top of a banding profile at 6655. Can someone explain why at exactly 6655 and not say more or less.

It does not change. Even after a modem reboot. Its like the line capable of going higher but can't because its locked/capped to that profile. If a line is set to a banded profile can that line go higher? And how long will it take to move to a higher band?

I live in the South London/North Surrey area. How can i find out why my line dropped to a unusable speed of way below 1Mbps over the Christmas period?

BTW. My service is not a fibre.

Re: Pulling my hair out over PlusNet lack of support.

jab1 — Wed, 20 Mar 2024 13:42:01 GMT

I am aware you are on ADSL - your use of the 2704 proves that, as does the data contained in the screenshot. Now can you do as I asked and post your current Help Desk?

Re: Pulling my hair out over PlusNet lack of support.

KitKite — Wed, 20 Mar 2024 15:11:43 GMT

(Sorry if this is a 2nd reply i think i didn't send it???)

Yes Sure.

What do you mean '...current helpdesk?' Is it the PlusNet support question number or the modem stats or some thing else? Not sure

Re: Pulling my hair out over PlusNet lack of support.

jab1 — Wed, 20 Mar 2024 15:16:25 GMT

The modem stats- as in your first post, in the form of the bit that starts ' Your Plusnet adviser may ask you for the following information:'

Re: Pulling my hair out over PlusNet lack of support.

KitKite — Wed, 20 Mar 2024 15:38:37 GMT

Your Plusnet adviser may ask you for the following information:

1 - Product name: Plusnet Router

2 - Serial number: N7171081B005543

3 - Firmware version: 7.275.17_F2704N_Plusnet

4 - Board version: F@ST2704N

5 - Mode ADSL

6 - Uptime: 2 days 03:14:22

7 - Data rate: 1180/6655

8 - Maximum data rate: 1180/10872

9 - Noise margin: 5.4/11.7

10 - Line attenuation: 22.2/42.5

12 - Data sent/received: 616.3M/1.9G

20 - Broadband username: t@plusdsl.net

21 - Wi-Fi network/SSID: PLUSNET-TPX7JR

22 - Wi-Fi connections: Enable(802.11 b/g/n(up to 144 Mb/s))20 MHz WPS disabled

23 - Wi-Fi security: WPA2

24 - Wi-Fi channel: 10

25 - Firewall: Default

26 - MAC Address: f4:6b:ef:8d:e7:4b

27 - Software variant Version 1.0

28 - Boot loader: 7.275.6

Re: Pulling my hair out over PlusNet lack of support.

jab1 — Wed, 20 Mar 2024 15:42:57 GMT

In the absence of any further information, and providing you haven't turned the router off in the past three days, you have a DSL connection issue which - whatever Plusnet say - requires investigation.

Re: Pulling my hair out over PlusNet lack of support.

Gandalf — Wed, 20 Mar 2024 16:49:43 GMT

@KitKite - looking into this, the MTBE (Mean Time Between Errors) is 1 which means within the last 24 hours, the line has been producing errors every second, and currently at this moment, there are 132 errored seconds.

This would very likely be causing the banded profile of 'WBC 3M - 6M Medium delay (INP 2) 6dB Downstream\, UC Low delay (INP 0) 6dB Upstream (ADSL2+)', highlighted the significant part of the profile.

I would say that removing the banding without first addressing the underlying issue won't be wise, as a higher speed would likely mean more errors produced more frequently then the connection suffers.

Errors are often caused by routers which are starting to fail, but microfilters or internal wiring could also play a part, so might be worth troubleshooting: Broadband problems and how to fix them (Fibre with phone) | Help | Plusnet

Re: Pulling my hair out over PlusNet lack of support.

jab1 — Wed, 20 Mar 2024 17:26:17 GMT

@Gandalf - This is an ADSL connection. 😉

Re: Pulling my hair out over PlusNet lack of support.

Gandalf — Wed, 20 Mar 2024 17:35:11 GMT

Good spot, but it looks like ADSL and FTTC troubleshooting are compressed into one support article, with the URL showing it as fibre when in reality it can be used for ADSL as well. More specifically, the above link was from Broadband problems and how to fix them | Help | Plusnet selecting the 'Packages with a home phone line' option.

Re: Pulling my hair out over PlusNet lack of support.

jab1 — Wed, 20 Mar 2024 17:43:20 GMT

OK. Not splitting hairs here, and appreciate your support, @Gandalf , but a couple of things in that Help Desk shot stand out to me and suggest it is a OR network issue (1) the 'Uptime' figure and (2) the horrendous D/S noise margin. It's a long while since I've been on ADSL, but if those figures showed up in my Help Desk, I'd be screaming blue murder.

Re: Pulling my hair out over PlusNet lack of support.

Gandalf — Wed, 20 Mar 2024 18:39:35 GMT

The high noise margin is a symptom of the line being banded, these two would go hand in hand.

And the relatively low uptime just means the router disconnected at least once ~2 days ago.

I’m not ruling out an issue on Openreach’s side, but think it would be prudent for more checks to be done.

Re: Pulling my hair out over PlusNet lack of support.

jab1 — Wed, 20 Mar 2024 19:03:45 GMT

Agreed, @Gandalf , but if the OP carries out the relevant checks on their equipment and they come back as clear, will PN/OR sort the issue?

As a point of interest, as I was going to ask anyway, does the OP have the option of FTTC or FTTP, as both of these are considerably more reliable than ADSL?

Re: Pulling my hair out over PlusNet lack of support.

pvmb — Thu, 21 Mar 2024 00:04:16 GMT

@KitKite wrote:

Thanks for the reply.

My frustration is that PlusNet has not or avoided making any comment or apology to the system failure in my area at christmas.

My modem is stable at the very top of a banding profile at 6655. Can someone explain why at exactly 6655 and not say more or less.

It does not change. Even after a modem reboot. Its like the line capable of going higher but can't because its locked/capped to that profile. If a line is set to a banded profile can that line go higher? And how long will it take to move to a higher band?

May I stick my oar in here?

"I believe my lines banded profile got reset to a lower one with an upper DL speed of 6655.
Plusnet do not want to reset my download speed to the pre Christmas weekend. The have basically capped it at 6655."

I wonder... Obviously I am unfamiliar with your situation and BB issues, but your post chimes with my experience when I was last on ADSL 2+ (Now on 40/10 FTTC ).

I too ended up banded, on the top banding: 7168Kb/s - 14336Kb/s

And, interestingly, like you I was always slap bang up against the top end of that band - exactly 14336Kb/s - whatever I did with the router. This implied to me what I already knew: my line could go slightly faster ~15,000Kb/s. I could even get that maximum speed if I asked for a DLM reset. It worked until it didn't. That is until early in the morning around 5am it mysteriously reset to 14336Kb/s. What was wrong with my line? Nothing. Nobody could every find anything wrong with it, it just wouldn't work at the higher rate. Still less the speed it had originally worked at. That was a reliable and solid 18Mbps at 3db SNRM, every day. And I turned the router off every night!

Originally with TalkTalk, I then changed to PN and the line was the same. Then I went through a horrible couple of years with repeating, extremely intermittent faults, that were never there when you looked for them. Only when you weren't looking for them. Long story but I eventually got two faults removed.

Things returned to 'normal' - that is 18Mbps download at 3db SNRM - for a blissful period. Then an event. Nothing was ever the same again, it was slower ~16/15Mbps. As the years went by things only got slowly worse over time. There was still no 'fault' on my line. Whatever I tried I could never get back my original 18Mbps download.

I decided there must be some unacknowledged change to the way BT/Openreach managed ADSL lines via the DLM. I could never get PN to accept this. In the end I gave up fighting the system, decided ADSL was simply obsolescent and on the way out. I changed to FTTC and it just works (as ADSL used to in those far off days of 18Mbps). My 40/10 FTTC is presumably helped over any bumps with its high SNRM.

I recently looked at the Openreach availability of BB to my address and was genuinely shocked to see that ADSL 2+ is now shown as down to a meagre 7 Mbps to my address! Funnily enough, its recorded "Highest recorded speed" was still shown as me on my 14336Kb/s ADSL back when I was still on ADSL 2+. Almost twice the current shown maximum expected speed. 😮

Possibly you need to now consider a move away from ADSL (assuming this is possible for you)?

Re: Pulling my hair out over PlusNet lack of support.

KitKite — Thu, 21 Mar 2024 13:50:57 GMT

I've gone through the troubleshooting link

Including the following

Checked cables are ok and plugged in correctly

Disconnected the connected phone and its power supply

I also disconnect any other local power supplies

Swapped out the ADSL filter.

Rebooted router last night. I noticed no change.

Re: Pulling my hair out over PlusNet lack of support.

Townman — Fri, 22 Mar 2024 11:00:44 GMT

This has the hallmarks of SHINE / REIN interference. Notably it started around Christmas time ... possibly coincident with the acquisition of new electronics.

SHINE / REIN will cause repeated disconnections, leading to banding (with an elevated SNRM) in an attempt to maintain the stability of the connection. In such circumstances, one is faced with either a slower more stable connection or a faster very unstable connection. The absence of a discernible fault on the line also supports the possibility of local / environmental interference.

Detecting this is far from easy. I have done this with an AM radio tuned to 612KHz - see ::. Kitz - REIN, SHINE & RFI .::

However, the best way to investigate this is to run dynamic monitoring of the connection's SNRM; this needs to be done 24x7 with a 10 second sample rate. Routerstats (see Internet Software (vwlowen.co.uk)) is the go to product for this, but the router needs to be amenable to exposing the required data. I think that the lite version works with the 2704 router - I do not recall clearly.

If you have an older router from Plusnet which you can try (for example the TG582n which works well with the full version or a Plusnet Hub1 / BTHH5a for which there is a special version) you might gain insight to what is happening in your local environment.